375 H&H vs 416 Rem vs 416 Rigby

[Obi Wan Kenobi]

Gentlemen, hello this is my first time to this forum and I'm excited to be here. I've been scrolling the last few days just reading. Signed up today because I have a mighty task at hand.

A little about me I'm 43 years old. I've hunted mainly in Canada & across North America. I've hunted almost all the deer species except for moose and elk but they are on my list. I've hunted whitetails in the south all my life.

In 2014 my dad and I got the itch and we went to Africa for a father son plains game hunt and it was an incredible experience. I'm 6 feet tall 280 lbs broad shoulders and pretty muscular legs. I shot my 325 wsm with factor 200 grain accubonds, it put everything we shot on its ass including a huge blue wildabeest. All one shot kills.

I just booked a lion and plains game hunt for May 2018 and my heart is pounding. The biggest gun I own is my 325 wsm. Should I buy the 375 H&H or 416? I have no interest in ever hunting an elephant or hippo. Buffalo and crocodile are down the line later. But I figure if you're going to shoot a lion drop a serious hammer if I can shoot it straight.

I'm willing to spend up to 1,500 to 2,500 for a nice dependable rifle. I'm a little prejudiced. I only try to hunt with Zeiss optics, Swaro or high end Leopold stuff.

I love Sako for the smooth actions but I'm not spending 9,000 for a safari gun I also love Coopers but not spending 6,500 on these 416s or 375s. One more thing will barrel length matter? I'm accustomed to shooting 24 inch and 22 inch barreled rifles.

Whats good gentlemen and what can I do with this budget? Hunting is a passion for me! I'm a pretty successful business guy in my personal life and I've been a pretty successful hunter as well, because I'm very good at being humble, shutting up and listening to those who've been there done than. Sorry to ramble looking forward to answers.

 

[Ridge Top Ranch]

Seen an awful lot of CZ's in the hands of PHs. Can buy for $1200 or less. .416 Rigby seemed the most popular caliber.

 

[Bullthrower338]

Welcome to the forum.
First .375 is minimum cal for dangerous game in most countries. So that being said, you should absolutely purchase a new rifle Many fine rifles are available in your budget, a nice M70, Kimber Caprivi, Kimber Kalteetna, or a fine Ruger RSM. You will find that most on this site are enablers and will try to encourage the purchase of a new rifle and I whole heartedly agree with them. I've found the best way to determine which rifle I like most is to buy one of each. I really can't tell which I like most so I keep them all as a happy little family and enjoy shooting all of them. Find one that fits you well and enjoy it, any of your cal choices shall be fine for lion and plains game. I have used both 416's and 375 on Elk in North America and both are excellent choices for moose.
Cheers,
Cody

 

[sheephunterab]

If Elephant is not on the list I'd say go with the H&H. It's a very effective plains game and buffalo/lion chambering. I shoot mine out to 300 yards with no worries and with a ballistic reticle scope one could easily push that to 500 yards. It's just a great all-round choice.

 

[AZDAVE]

Welcome to the site! Hard to go wrong with a 375H&H. I haven't shot a 416 REM but have shot my 416 Rigby allot. First up you will need to make sure that the rifle fits you, it is much more important the farther up the recoil scale you go. Do you have anyone in your area that will let you shoot the calibres you mentioned? The best way I can equate the recoil is the difference between your 325WSM and 375 is add the recoil of a 30/06 on top of your 325. The bump from the 375 to the 416 is like a 375 and 325 put together. I sold a nice Ruger RMS 416 Rigby to a local guy that said no problem I can handle it. Well I now have that rifle back in my safe with only 2 rounds out of the box shot. You are a big guy and one of the things that physics will play out is that you will absorb a good bit more recoil before it starts to move your shoulder back, so like when you played football or rugby when your get hit by something bigger the ability to roll with the impact makes the recoil much easier to learn to deal with. make sure your first shots are off a standing bench or offhand. Too many guys shot their first big bore off a bench and get the stuffing knocked out of them and or scope bite and never really learn to shoot the bigger rifles. Take your time, have fun, learn to love big bore. However I will warn you that the 375 is the entry into big bore club that is very addictive Just read the "Big Bore Addiction Group" post in the 375 and up part of the forum.

 

[greyfox]

Where in the south are you? I've got a 375 you can try out (it's a SAKO with a Leupold!!)
I don't think you can go wrong with any of them.
I've often contempleted building a 416 on a SAKO action, just haven't yet, but that's an option.

 

[BWH]

What all is on your list? If lion or Buff is top of the chain, 375 is good. Going Higher.... Might as well not stop at 375 & go 416, in whatever gun/caliber/ammo makes sense for your situation.

 

[BWH]

I spent $1000 on a badass browning 375. Your budget would allow for a great gun, scope & ton of ammo!

 

[Hank2211]

First, welcome to the site.

Second, as noted, you will need a new rifle if the hunt is to be legal. Even though a .300 Win Mag in the right place will do all the damage you need, with lion, you don't want to fool around. A wounded lion will almost always head into the thickest stuff around to wait for you. I say almost always, because when it doesn't, it charges right away. Either way, you haven't done your part of the job and others will likely end up at some risk. Not a situation a hunter should ever want to put himself or others in.

Third, so if this is the case, what's the right gun? I have a .375 H&H, a .404 Jeffery and a .416 Rigby. In my experience - and I've used all three in Africa on lion, elephant and buffalo - I've always felt a bit undergunned with the .375. It's a wonderful gun, the recoil is very manageable, and I just used it on a small nocturnal species hunt (with solids) to avoid destroying the little guys. It also did exceptionally well on a giraffe. A versatile gun. More versatile than the .404 and the .416.

Having said that, both the .404 and the .416 shoot 25% more lead (400 gr vs. 300gr), and just pack more punch. They aren't as versatile as the .375 in that you wouldn't normally use them on plains game, at least not at any distance, while you certainly could with the .375, but when you need the extra punch, you have it. And it's nice to have it on dangerous game, which tends to be shot fairly up close and personal. If you are recoil sensitive, then the .404 would be a great choice. If not, well, then it's up to you. The .416 - whether Rigby or the others - hits harder, and recoils harder. But with a good, well balanced gun, it's certainly manageable. You're a big guy, so I assume recoil isn't an issue. As between the Rigby and the others, I'd pick the Rigby only because of the romance of the old cartridge.

Finally, if you get a .375 now, you will like might well want something bigger down the road. You say you have no intention of hunting elephant or hippo. I said the same thing once, and now I have more rifles than I need! And it seems you've got the bug already. So if you are or expect to be limited in the number of guns you can afford, I'd go for the bigger gun now. That would give you a great plains game rifle and a wonderful dangerous game rifle.

And there's nothing wrong with that.

 

[zephyr]

Hank2211 has given some great advice and I would read what he has to say more than once. I might venture to add that the light 40's, 400H&H, 416 Rem, Ruger, Taylor and Rigby are IMHO honest 200yrd rifles with a 400gr bullet around 2400fps. For more versatility if you are a handloader, 300 or 350gr bullets from a light 40 traveling 2500 to 2700fps would be awesome Lion and plains game medicine.
Take a hard look at the new Win mod 70 express, out of the box they are hard to beat, I have two semi custom guns made from these. I have extended the stock on my guns to 14.5" to fit my frame and am very happy with the Winchester stock dynamics and it's ability to mitigate recoil.
Good Luck, doing the looking an research is half the fun of any up and coming hunting trip.
Keep us posted

 

[wesheltonj]

Well that's price on the SAKO is if you buy the Safari version. If you go with the Classic ($2050), you can get that in 375. The downside its one pound lighter. For someone your size that might not make a difference, for me I add a slip-on pad and its manageable. Have a Leica Scope on mine.

375 will kill everything in Africa and has since 1912.

 

[bassasdaindia]

welcome and best of luck in your decision, it is part of the fun .

 

[bassasdaindia]

you are on the correct track with any of the 3 calibers you mention , out of the box the Winchester M70 leads the race for me .

personally I find the M70 unbalanced in the 375 , and better balanced in the 416 Remington, these are all personal preferences.

the 375 is a more versatile caliber than the 416's .

these topics have multiple answers, my "quick " reply would be the M70 in 416 Remington , and take along your 325 for plains game .

good luck

 

[CAustin]

I wouldn't leave out the 416 Ruger! The guide gun is affordable and with a good Luepold scope with CDS the distance shits are not difficult!

 

[Beans]

If I was in your shoes look at the 416 Rigby. You have a 325WSM then you need to step up more than just to a 375. I have a 8x68S, it is identical to the 325. Also .323 dia. They have an edge over the 300's and it says so in Cartriges of the World as well. It works wonders on all Cats!

Moving to the 416's you might look at putting a mercury pack in the stock. It makes them real manageble to shoot even off a bench.

The 416's carries alot of punch and you are just better off with that in your hands especially if things don't go as planned. We are hunting, things never always goes textbook style. That is why you have to plan for the worst that might happen. Then you will be prepared when that situation arises.

There is lots of good advice from other members to you!

Have fun with your planning and post pictures

 

[375 Ruger Fan]

I wouldn't leave out the 416 Ruger! The guide gun is affordable and with a good Luepold scope with CDS the distance shits are not difficult!

Both the 375 Ruger and 416 Ruger are ballistically equivalent to their old classic counterparts and represent great value. A lot of bang for the buck.

 

[Alexandro Faria]

Just my 2c worth: I saw someone say that the .416 is less versatile... If you handload, I must respectfully disagree. I can think of 2 local companies where I can get hold of 240gr projectiles, all the way up to 450gr. If that's not versatility, I don't know what is. I assume ammo prices aren't really an issue for you, so the .416 won't be a problem. Just be sure you can handle the thump. I know you said you don't want to over spend, but a big bore like that really can kick. Perhaps spending a little extra on having a no frills, practical rifle custom builr for you would be a good idea? Personally, if you're gonna hunt africa, do it with an african classic. Limit your choices to the H&H and the Rigby. In closing, the rigby has my vote, but I went for the H&H and it is definitely a wonder cartridge. You'll ve impressed with both. It all comes down to you and if you can handle the smack.

 

[siml]

Welcome to AH. I would say go for the 375.

 

[PaulT]

"Welcome to AH. I would say go for the 375".

I totally agree with Simon.
If you're not going to hunt Elephant then for the few buff you may be fortunate to hunt during your life the .375 will be perfectly adequate and more versatile for the more than 90% of other game you will hunt with it.

I have taken several dozen buffalo and an equal amount of feral Oxen, a lot of the time hunting alone with no form of external back-up, with a .375 and felt totally comfortable and in control.

Use a premium grade projectile and train yourself to be able to direct it to the vital region and you will be as good as gold.

I've never appreciated a marked difference in reaction on buffalo between the .375 and a .416, mostly because most of the .416 users I've seen were not as proficient and comfortable with their firearms as were the .375 users.

If your going to be doing a LOT of buffalo hunting then you would be better served in stepping up to a .458 Lott or similar.

Good luck and good hunting.

 

[spike.t]

agree with Beans as i like the Rigby, and from what he says about the .325 then a move up to the Rigby above the .375hh sounds sensible, but also agree with simon and paul that the .375hh is easier to become more proficient with . if you are going to take both rifles when you hunt then i would go for the .416 Rigby/404 jeff option with your .325 . but if you only end up taking one then go with the .375 option.