.500 vs .577 vs .600 NE

[cal pappas]

Factory .600 ammo is 45-50$ per round. I have never bought factory ammo in the 30+ years I have been playing with doubles. .600 is from Kynamco and is the only factory loads available but custom loaders will make some up on your brass for 10-15$ per round.

 

[grand veneur]

These cartridges are even more expensive in Europe. Here you have to expect per round more than 50 Euros for the 577NE and 60 Euros for the 600NE.

I reload both , but I don't know for what price. I got many cartridges with the DR caliber 577NE , also old ones from Kynoch and loaded with Cordite , some of which I use as components. I also have enough new shells and bullets. With the purchase of the DR caliber 600NE , I got everything with it what I need for reloading , to be able to shoot for years.

If you are not a reloader and want to fire such cartridges regularly , you need a lot of money.

 

[robert kuester]

Price is why I reload all my ammo from 22Hornet to 577Nitro my self.

 

[jdemocko]

Another angle to consider, if your PH is carrying a double, what caliber is he using. On 2 of my safaris both my PH's carried a 500 NE as I did. We had plenty of ammo between us. My PH in Zim loved my CEB loads so much I gave him all my leftovers. Most of the PH's I know carry a 500 NE as a stopper.

 

[Red Leg]

Another angle to consider, if your PH is carrying a double, what caliber is he using. On 2 of my safaris both my PH's carried a 500 NE as I did. We had plenty of ammo between us. My PH in Zim loved my CEB loads so much I gave him all my leftovers. Most of the PH's I know carry a 500 NE as a stopper.

I bet he did love them. I suspect any PH who carries a double would be ecstatic to get his client’s unused ammunition. As I think about it, most are pretty grateful for any bolt action loads as well.

 

[RayAtkinson]

I shot a lot of Buffalo with my two 450-400-3" guns, a .470 and a few with a 450-3.25 and I liked the 450 best, but not to say that I ever needed more than the 450-400, In bolt guns I used the 9.3x62, 404, 416 REm. 458, 458 Lott, 375, and the 505...In truth I never could see any differenct in any of them..bullet placement and bullet construction is all that counts..Compare the size of an elephant to the 700 N.E. and tell me its going knock ole Tembo off his feet, get real! These caliber DG syndrome is mostly Penis envy!

BTW, " A stopper" is just a word, a 500 gr. bullet against a 2000 lb animal? besides a stopper is to hold water in a bathtub!! Being a capable shot is the best caliber out there..

 

[Poc4u]

I own a B. Searcy two barrel set 470 and 577 I hunted all of the big five with the exception of lion (Obama got to it before I could hunt them) Anyway, I carry my 470 99% of the time when hunting and it has been more then enough even on elephant, the only time I switched barrel to the 577 was following up my wounded buffalo which we eventually found dead from the 470 shot. 577 is a nice round when you have someone carry the rifle for you (my son carried the extra barrels ) but practical hunting is best done with something lighter.

Are you going to hunt with it? Back in February you asked opinions between a .470 and .500.

Now, it is .500, .577 or a .600?

All of the guns, if you buy from a reputable manufacturer will be accurate enough (regulated to 2" @50 meters). So, accuracy and handling will be up to you.

As you go up in caliber the weight of the gun will be going up. My .500 weighs 11.6 pounds, .577 will weigh in at 12.5 and I think most .600s are 14 pounds and up. Cost of the rifles scale up with the caliber as well for the most part.

In regards to stopping power assuming correct shot placement all of them will have the stopping power. Penetration is more dependent on the bullet than the caliber (to a certain extent), not that many selections for .600.

Personally, of the three, I'd go with the .500 NE for the reasons you mentioned. However, as people mentioned in the thread from February I'd go with the .470 NE for your purposes.

 

[RayAtkinson]

I see absolutely no use for a 577 or 600...The 500 is somewhat better, and the 470 or 450-3.25 is the most desirable and all the gun in the world one could ask for...I suggest you consider return to battery with these big guns when your barrels are up in the air and a buff is running under it??? food for thought much overlooked...Personally I prefered the 450-400-3" for all my DG hunting..I have an interesting film of a group I sent to Zim for buffalo, one bull they shot 9 times with a 500 and 577, another 13 times, go figure what happens under stress..Those bulls IMO would have been killed with two or thee shots it they could shoot, recoil became the villian..Says a lot for the 375 H&H IMO..

 

[Forrest Halley]

I see absolutely no use for a 577 or 600...The 500 is somewhat better, and the 470 or 450-3.25 is the most desirable and all the gun in the world one could ask for...I suggest you consider return to battery with these big guns when your barrels are up in the air and a buff is running under it??? food for thought much overlooked...Personally I prefered the 450-400-3" for all my DG hunting..I have an interesting film of a group I sent to Zim for buffalo, one bull they shot 9 times with a 500 and 577, another 13 times, go figure what happens under stress..Those bulls IMO would have been killed with two or thee shots it they could shoot, recoil became the villian..Says a lot for the 375 H&H IMO..

I shoot my .375. I endure my .458 Lott. Yeah yeah you don't feel the recoil under the rush of the hunt...but I'll bet you keep that flinch.

 

[IvW]

I see absolutely no use for a 577 or 600...The 500 is somewhat better, and the 470 or 450-3.25 is the most desirable and all the gun in the world one could ask for...I suggest you consider return to battery with these big guns when your barrels are up in the air and a buff is running under it??? food for thought much overlooked...Personally I prefered the 450-400-3" for all my DG hunting..I have an interesting film of a group I sent to Zim for buffalo, one bull they shot 9 times with a 500 and 577, another 13 times, go figure what happens under stress..Those bulls IMO would have been killed with two or thee shots it they could shoot, recoil became the villian..Says a lot for the 375 H&H IMO..

I guess the issue of shot placement comes to mind......rather than caliber....if you need that amount of lead from a 500 and 577 I think they cannot shoot them well enough and should step down in caliber to something they can shoot....

 

[Tanks]

I guess the issue of shot placement comes to mind......rather than caliber....if you need that amount of lead from a 500 and 577 I think they cannot shoot them well enough and should step down in caliber to something they can shoot....

I don't know why people automatically assume that if one shoots a true big bore then they are not capable of shooting it accurately. Every elephant I have shot, I have shot with a .500 caliber and will continue to do so unless I wish to try one of my other guns like a .450 NE.

My view on this is that people should shoot the largest caliber they can accurately shoot, caliber matters, especially when shooting solids. I will take a disabling shoulder shot on an elephant with a .500, I would not want to attempt it with a .375 that makes tiny (relatively speaking) holes.

 

[AES]

Would someone care to attempt to convey the difference in recoil in a 416 Rig v 500 NE? Realistically the answer should be the same as comparing a 500/416 v 500ne. Am just curious as to what to expect.

 

[Saul]

I don't know why people automatically assume that if one shoots a true big bore then they are not capable of shooting it accurately. Every elephant I have shot, I have shot with a .500 caliber and will continue to do so unless I wish to try one of my other guns like a .450 NE.

My view on this is that people should shoot the largest caliber they can accurately shoot, caliber matters, especially when shooting solids. I will take a disabling shoulder shot on an elephant with a .500, I would not want to attempt it with a .375 that makes tiny (relatively speaking) holes.

Do you find your shooting noticeably improved with your .450 NE over your .500 NE?

 

[Tanks]

Recoil calculators can do a basic comparison. However, the fit and design of the stock has a lot of impact on "felt" recoil as well. My .500 NE and .500 MDM are more of a push rather than a fast snap and I seem to able to roll with the recoil, I don't know how the .416 reacts.

 

[Tanks]

Do you find your shooting noticeably improved with your .450 NE over your .500 NE?

Not that I noticed with the amount of factory rounds I have put through them. I still need to develop loads for both with Cutting Edge bullets. I also have yet to put the Trijicon red dots on them. If I were leaving for Africa tomorrow I would leave both at home as I wouldn't want to use the Hornady factory loads with them.

Now, comparing the .500 MDM and .458 B&M (almost the same diameter as above) there is no perceptible difference in accuracy that I noticed with CEB bullets.

 

[Tanks]

I bet he did love them. I suspect any PH who carries a double would be ecstatic to get his client’s unused ammunition. As I think about it, most are pretty grateful for any bolt action loads as well.

Funny story about that. When I was leaving Zim last time, the customs guy counted my ammunition and commented that I must be a great shot as most guys do not take back as high percentage of ammo that they brought in as I did.

I didn't want to tell him that it was most likely because I was using wildcats and the others were using regular ammo that they left behind with their PHs.

 

[John J]

Would someone care to attempt to convey the difference in recoil in a 416 Rig v 500 NE? Realistically the answer should be the same as comparing a 500/416 v 500ne. Am just curious as to what to expect.

I have never shot a 500 NE. I did have a CZ in 416 Rigby for a short time. For me the rifle was brutal. May have been stock fit, the rifle weight was certainly there. My 500 MDM can be considered a pleasure to shoot compared to the 416 R. I can shoot the 500 off the bench without issue. Not a direct answer but the best I can prove. John

 

[SAFARIKIDD]

Everyone has their favs...I had them from 500 to 700 and 8 & 4 Bore Doubles too..
My first double in Africa was the 500NE and it was very easy to carry and shoot..Performed well...Buy MY fav was my 577...those 750's rock!
(This is 2 I took seconds apart, both with 1 shot with it )
To answer your original question a 500NE is a reasonable selection

 

[JPmbogo]

I would suggest finding a double rifle that comes up like a fine English game gun (i.e., shotgun) in 450, 470 or 500. I realize that being able to do that is quite difficult since there aren't many (if any) shops where you can walk in and "try on" a number of double rifles. I attended the DSC convention back in January. There I was able to do what I just described. I have owned several double rifles over the years, but at the time of the convention, the cupboard was bare, so to speak. I was seriously considering a buff hunt and wanted a nice double for the hunt. I ended up purchasing a vintage WR in .470 for a reasonable price. Having been a bird hunter over the years more than a big game hunter, I was looking for the balance noted above and the Westley fits that bill perfectly. On the other hand, if you are just looking for a toy, Varney Carron is offering a 700 Nitro. Ouch!

 

[Poc4u]

Hi all,

I know this is gonna sound kinda touché, but I have a problem deciding on which double rifle caliber to go with.

When looking at ammo availability and affordability, the .500 NE is clearly the best option. HOWEVER, which one do you who use and have used these bigger double calibers recommend when it comes to stopping power, accuracy, and penetration?

Real excited to see what you all of you say.

, Rootball

If this is your first double I would advise you to start with 375 H&H, like everyone else you’re going to shoot your rifle at the range 99% of the time so it’s very important that you get used to handling the recoil without developing a flinch. The 375 will be enough gun to handle pretty much everything, and will give you a chance to “grow” into shooting a double correctly.
I started with a 470 only because I wanted a double and one of my clients was selling a 470 At the right price so I couldn’t say no. Needless to say it took me a while and many scraped fingers to get used to it. Since then I bought shot and sold many doubles in different calibers, ( currently have seven) I’ve been to Africa three times and collected my big three ( never cared for a green Rhino and couldn’t beat the ban on the lion but I’m still hoping) I shot my elephant and buffalo with the 470, I took two cull buffs with my 577 and a big zebra with my 500. The one that bothers me the most till this day is my 500 NE only because it’s an 11 pound gun and it really kills on both ends. My 577 Searcy is a pussycat at 15 -1/5 pounds.
I owned a 16 pound Jules Bury 600 NE for a while, I shot a Bison with it and it did what I expected, it killed the animal. Start relatively light and you’ll have plenty of time to graduate to something heavier once you become addicted (yes it is an addiction) to hunting with a double rifle, as far as calibers, from 375 on up they all perform pretty much the same as long as you do your part and put the lead in right place.
Cheers