Accuracy and .375 Flanged

[Timur]

Greetings gentlemen,

I really like this forum and I've been lurking in the background for some time now (sounds more keepy than it is). I especially enjoyed dugaboy's posts and I salute you Sir. And this brings me to the topic.

Im a bolt guy thru and thru, but due to midlife crisis and the decline of my manly prowess i've been thinking of finally getting a double rifle (heym 88b). Kids don't need an inheritage and they will probably grow up to dissapoint you anyway.

The thing is im not anywhere near enough rich to hunt African big game on regular basis so these projects will most probably be one-off kind of adventures for me. So buying a big boar double just because they make daddy droole doesn't really make all that much sense. On the other hand if I would also invest in a pair of .375 Flanged barrels I could use "the precious one" as a everyday hunting tool here in Europe.

So I have a a couple questions regarding s&s doubles. The first one is about accuracy. If scoped can i espect sufficent accuracy to -150m? Is the accuracy enough for example a leopard hunt? Unfortunately my 338 lapua is not enough of a gun due to the .375 rule.


Regarding scopes I fully understand the logic why it's recomended to use scopes that are low enough but when hunting for example wild boar in moonlight/twilight you really need a 50-56mm bugger on your rifle. Is this doable as occasional setup on a s&s double?

Kind regards,
Timur

 

[Witold Krzyżanowski]

Welcome to AH Timur.
Good luck.
Witold

 

[sierraone]

Welcome to the site. We have more than a few guys than can answer your question. I have a good idea of the answer but don't have the experience. So those of you that do,,,,Help the man!!!

 

[ScottG]

Welcome Sir, good luck.

 

[fsrmg1]

Hi Timur,

Welcome. Like you, I dream of hunting Africa, but the reality is that if I'm lucky, I'll only make it there a few times for plains game and maybe a buffalo at best. This is why I don't own a bunch of your large traditional white hunter calibre guns that just sits in the safe. My safe is full of working guns. Luckily I grew up in Alaska and am currently living in Australia, so I do have some useful large calibres. I have also lived and worked in Europe for a number of years and found some of the best hunting in my life over there. All these places have shaped what firearms I own and how I set them up for action.

What is the biggest game you are planning on hunting outside of Europe? The 375 calibre minimum rule is not applied across all countries or even all species of DG. There are a number of countries where you can hunt DG with the 9.3mm on up, or even your 338.

It sounds like you want to buy a rifle that you can use on your African hunt as well as home in Europe. I think that most modern double rifles of quality will shoot accurately to at least 150m, some a bit further. I have a Beretta O/U 9.3x74R that is perfectly regulated and I wouldn't hesitate an aimed shot out to 200m, possibly a bit more.

My recommendation is for you to get something that you can still use back home for stalking. A nice and trim 9.3x74R to 375 H&H would be good. Keep in mind the ammo situation, so unless you load your own or can get custom ammo, the 375 Flanged might present a problem. The belted version might be the way to go. I know someone who bought the belted version and had it modified to shoot the flanged version as well. He mainly used the flanged, but if needed could install the ejector clips and shoot the belted.

As far as scopes go, you will most likely have to forget the large objective low light ones on a SxS hard kicker. You can look around though to see what state of the art stuff is out there that might work. Get a tough scope and mounting system that won't rattle apart if you do go that way. I use a semi-compact 2-7x with a 33mm objective on my Beretta.

Good luck and happy hunting to you.

 

[Pondoro]

The .375H&H is not a good choice in a double as it is a high pressure round and not rimmed...9,3x74R or .375 Flanged are much better in that respect.

I would never hunt DG with a double rifle that uses a non-rim cartridge because of possible extraction issues, perhaps a moot point today....but...

The .375 Flanged is so close to the belted .375 performancewise so I would take it over the 9,3....in fact I contemplate building a barrel set in that calibre for my heavy double..

 

[Timur]

Thank you all

I explained myself a bit poorly. This may indeed sound a bit perverted, but the idea is to clean up the gunvault. Guns should be collectables and/or used. So the plan is to bid farewell to to a one shotgun, my trusted 7mm rem.mag, a 30-06, a .375h&h replace them with a sauer 404 in 8x68s. The rational choice would be to add a .416 with CRF action to the mix and I'd be set for anything from roe deer up. The 338 lapua is not a hunting rifle per se.

However a .416 would have the same limitations as a big boar double: my mortgage would seriously limit it's god's intended purpose. So the other option im looking into is a dakota m76 with a .375 exchange barrel...but that would not scratch the double itch. There is nothing wrong with my .375 h&h exept that it's not a CRF and I have no use for two medium bore rifles. Furhermore i'd have a hard time explaining such a need to local authorities.

Unfortunately Jefferson wasn't one of the founding fathers for the EU.

I have nothing against the 9.3x74 but it does fall a bit short of the .375 rule and according to my knowledge Heym does not make them in their mid sized frames. Ammo is not an issue since I handload.

Not looking for sub MOA accuracy here. Adequate to -150m and possibly once in a lifetime leopard hunt would suffice just fine. Moose and wild boar will be it's primary diet...


Kind regards,
Timur

 

[Timur]

Hi Timur,

What is the biggest game you are planning on hunting outside of Europe? The 375 calibre minimum rule is not applied across all countries or even all species of DG. There are a number of countries where you can hunt DG with the 9.3mm on up, or even your 338.

The top 3 in my "things to hunt before your kid's rob you and ship you to a retirement facility to die" are cape buffalo, alaska grizzly and elephant. And then work myself (literally) up from there.

The smart thing would be to stick with my .375 sako but then again im not smart...



Kind regards,
Timur

 

[fsrmg1]

Hi Timur,

Get yourself a nice Heym double. A few people at my club use and recommend them for African DG hunting. The ones I've seen are the 450-400, 500-416, 470 and 500. All big bores for serious hunting. The only one to carry a scope (compact) was the 500-416 and it didn't seem to hinder or slow the shooter down. Just scope bite until he got used to it.

For what you want, anything from 375 on up will work. Speaking first hand, when it comes to big Alaskan bears, the 375 is king. It will give you all the range, penetration and power you'll ever need. I'm sure likewise for buffalo and many elephants have fallen to that calibre as well.

I like slim and trim stalking rifles, which is why I would go for a 9.3x74R or 405 Win if I could get my hands on one. I'll probably never be going after anything bigger than a buffalo if lucky to do so. That is why I wouldn't need anything bigger. I like for each of my guns to have a purpose and not end up as a safe queen.

 

[Bruce]

Welcome to AH.. good luck with your challenge!!

 

[dchamp]

Hi Timur, If you're looking to get a Sauer 404 in 8x68s anyway, why not add a .375H&H barrel and bolt head. That way you'll have two in one so to speak. It would simplify things. I looked at the Sauer 404 at the SCI convention and was impressed with its design.

The Blaser is another option, you can have the 8x68s and either the .375H&H or .416 Remington. I have both the 8x68s and .416 in a Blaser R8 and like it a lot. With the heavier Safari frame you could include the .458 Lott and .500 Jeffery.

But then again it's not a double.

 

[cpr0312]

Welcome, lots of knowledge on this site to draw from

 

[Bullhunter]

Hi Timur,

I know Heym doubles very well.

My tipp:
Get an "nice und slim" HEYM 88 LIGHT PH, this is an slim line double ( 20% less weigh and space as the normal modell), with 25 inch barrels and an scope.

It is perfect for the .375 Flg. and you can shoot the moste game with this rifle.
Even buffalo and elephant, if you shoot good.

You will see, this rifle is very accurat up to 100, 120 meters.
And you can use it open sighted too.

You will love that gun!!!

 

[enysse]

I'd get a 450-400, for the animals you are looking to hunt.