Electric cars are not as great for the planet as we are told it would seem....

[sgt_zim]

The globe has been heating up since the last ice age. Capt Cook recorded the position of the ice in glacier bay in the early 1600’s and it has been receding every year since, 300 years before fossil fuels were widely used. That big orb in the sky during the daytime hours is the source of the heat.
The fall of humanity as we know it will be the result of the lose of people willing to work and contribute value to society, to many give me I’m entitled people, not global climate change.
Humans will remain as long as there is food, water and air. It is just to be seen as how they will live.

Most of that heating was during the first half of the Holocene, the era the world has been in since the Pleistocene (the last ice age) ended.

There was enough heat applied to the earth's surface during that time period to completely melt continental glaciers that were 2 miles thick in what is today the Great Lakes region. There was enough ice melted to raise the sea level by 120 meters (~400 ft). If all ice in existence right now melted tomorrow, it would raise the sea level by another 60-70 meters.

We are presently about 18,000 years into the Holocene, and the overwhelming majority of ice melt occurred in the first 9000 years.

Working out the simple math, we see that average sea level rise during that time was ~1 meter every 75 years or so, which comes to about 4.5' every century. NOAA's worst case prediction is 6.5 feet (about .75"/year) in the next 100 years, and about 2.5 feet in the next hundred years on the low end, with 4' being the intermediate scenario.

None of that is out of line with what we know of the earth's natural history. While the *average* during the early Holocene was 1 meter every 75 years, it's a certainty that some centuries saw 2 or 3 or 4 meters of sea level rise, while other centuries saw little or even none.

 

[sgt_zim]

And for some perspective, have a look at this map

All of the very light blue coastal areas, that is sea bed which is no deeper than 300'. All of that very light blue area was dry land 20,000 years ago. One could have walked the entire way from present day Belfast to present day Paris and never seen any salt water. Same for going from northern Australia to Papua/New Guinea or Oz to Tasmania. Indonesia was part of the Asian landmass, and Malaysia wasn't a peninsula.

Present day Miami sits on a bed of oolite. Oolite only forms under water, and takes a while to form. All of the Florida peninsula was at one time under the Atlantic Ocean.

The seas rise and the seas fall, and pay very little heed to our comings and goings.

 

[rdog]

I think electric cars are for city living, green vegan nerds, you need gas guzzling V8s . most of the electric car wankers do not realize you need a coal fired power station to charge them. the cost of replacement batteries & the issues with disposing of them . Gun control & climate change & electric cars are all driven by off with the fairy's wokes.

here is mine & i have a smoke belching diesel 4x4 too.

 

[1dirthawker]

i have heard that the heater in the vehicle is also electric. i wonder how the EV does in the cold? everything turns harder in the cold and therefore uses more energy. since only 5 months a year would one not need a heater on constantly (i live in alaska) then the other 6/7 months the heater would be on constantly, i find it hard to believe i could take my snow machine 300 miles north with my EV truck, in below zero weather. then of course return after being in a remote location. naaah, i'll stick to my diesel truck.

 

[CoElkHunter]

i have heard that the heater in the vehicle is also electric. i wonder how the EV does in the cold? everything turns harder in the cold and therefore uses more energy. since only 5 months a year would one not need a heater on constantly (i live in alaska) then the other 6/7 months the heater would be on constantly, i find it hard to believe i could take my snow machine 300 miles north with my EV truck, in below zero weather. then of course return after being in a remote location. naaah, i'll stick to my diesel truck.

You just want your EV and be able to drive it too in sub zero weather! Adapt! LOL

 

[R eight]

i have heard that the heater in the vehicle is also electric. i wonder how the EV does in the cold? everything turns harder in the cold and therefore uses more energy. since only 5 months a year would one not need a heater on constantly (i live in alaska) then the other 6/7 months the heater would be on constantly, i find it hard to believe i could take my snow machine 300 miles north with my EV truck, in below zero weather. then of course return after being in a remote location. naaah, i'll stick to my diesel truck.

You’d be better off with a sleigh and a couple of caribou.

and don’t forget we generally start our diesel trucks with an electric motor……

 

[Wyatt Smith]

I think electric cars could be great, as soon as the car can make its own electricity. So what if it takes a small Diesel engine to run a generator, make a car get 100 miles to the gallon. That would help.
Take this as you will from a 7.3 powestroke driver.

 

[CoElkHunter]

I think electric cars could be great, as soon as the car can make its own electricity. So what if it takes a small Diesel engine to run a generator, make a car get 100 miles to the gallon. That would help.
Take this as you will from a 7.3 powestroke driver.

Maybe small generators at each wheel that when turned by the wheels generates electricity and HELPS to keep the battery pack charged? This comes from another 7.3 Powerstroke driver.

 

[rookhawk]

This is the future. Batteries are just an intermediary step. It isn’t hydrogen cars.

It’s nuclear power grid charging up people‘s cars that hold energy in these:

Could Ultracapacitors Replace Batteries in Future Electric Vehicles?

Ultracapacitors have been making the news of late but could they viably replace batteries in the EVs of the future?

interestingengineering.com

 

[oldfart009]

I don't think an alternate source of fuel is bad idea.
I think its a good think to reduce the demand of gasoline and the price also,
I hate that electric cars are being forced like some green new deal thingy.

 

[baxterb]

And for some perspective, have a look at this map

View attachment 452060

All of the very light blue coastal areas, that is sea bed which is no deeper than 300'. All of that very light blue area was dry land 20,000 years ago. One could have walked the entire way from present day Belfast to present day Paris and never seen any salt water. Same for going from northern Australia to Papua/New Guinea or Oz to Tasmania. Indonesia was part of the Asian landmass, and Malaysia wasn't a peninsula.

Present day Miami sits on a bed of oolite. Oolite only forms under water, and takes a while to form. All of the Florida peninsula was at one time under the Atlantic Ocean.

The seas rise and the seas fall, and pay very little heed to our comings and goings.

The summit of mt Everest is Qomolangma Limestone and was seabed about 450 million years ago. We can't even begin to understand the changes the earth has seen.

 

[rookhawk]

I don't think an alternate source of fuel is bad idea.
I think its a good think to reduce the demand of gasoline and the price also,
I hate that electric cars are being forced like some green new deal thingy.

But that isn’t what is happening, @oldfart009 , it is leftist politics that harms the world. If you wanted to use an alternative fuel that is cheap, abundant, and clean, we are awash in a sea of compressed natural gas.

It’s not about a clean environment, it’s about destroying industry, giving kickbacks to cronies, and exchanging the practically achievable for the theoretical.

Electric cars are pretty high performance but are not a proxy for a combustion engine in many cases. Everyone reasonable I know that has one, has many cars because of the combustion use-case electric doesn’t satisfy. (e.g. I’m diesel and will be diesel + electric soon)

WIthout commingling issues, the electric car is a separate issue than clean energy. Clean energy requires a clean grid and that cannot be done without a switch to nuclear. I have no delusions that my future electric vehicle (which I bought because its a very fast, fun toy) is not going to make an environmental difference EVEN IF I believed every bit of climate data and its causations, which I do not.

 

[oldfart009]

Well said buddy,
One other curiosity is they only mention CO{2} whereas there are other gasses. Diesels have both particulate and NOx issues that are not always addressed. On the battery side, there are sulfur gasses that have to be captured.

Low CO{2} is nice but compared to what?

 

[Bonk]

I live in a rural area but I'm only about 30 minutes away from the edge of two decent sized cities. We're still operating on DSL internet because that's all that's available. How in the world do they think EVs are going to be viable any time soon when the infrastructure can't even provide high speed internet? Internet is nothing more than running cable and hooking everybody up and we're still not there yet. Can you imagine the electrical grid infrastructure upgrades required to give all Americans the opportunity to own an EV? I'll never see it and I doubt my kids will either. I suppose my grandkids might.

Something no one ever brings up is industrial equipment. Do they really think there will ever be viable EV tractors, excavators, bulldozers, combines, etc?

Still clinging to my God, guns, tractors and pickups.

 

[1dirthawker]

another interesting aside regarding electric vehicles; as a fireman for 20 years, EV tech changed considerably during that time. i was on a rescue rig for a while and it was pretty interesting the changes that occurred ANNUALLY with the differing EV's.

the interesting (and dangerous) point is...no firefighter wants to cut a power cable to disable an EV. lethal voltage/ciurrents are available to the crew once one starts cutting up an EV. the wiring on each vehicle is routed different, and shutoffs are also different. the EV does not have to be the only vehicle in the situation, a diesel truck hits the EV and severely warps the frame/cab of the vehicle. passengers need to come out and the collision has made the EV a possible electrified vehicle. kinda scary stuff from my perspective.

anyway, if EV's were so great, why do they need to be subsidized??

 

[spike.t]

another interesting aside regarding electric vehicles; as a fireman for 20 years, EV tech changed considerably during that time. i was on a rescue rig for a while and it was pretty interesting the changes that occurred ANNUALLY with the differing EV's.

the interesting (and dangerous) point is...no firefighter wants to cut a power cable to disable an EV. lethal voltage/ciurrents are available to the crew once one starts cutting up an EV. the wiring on each vehicle is routed different, and shutoffs are also different. the EV does not have to be the only vehicle in the situation, a diesel truck hits the EV and severely warps the frame/cab of the vehicle. passengers need to come out and the collision has made the EV a possible electrified vehicle. kinda scary stuff from my perspective.

anyway, if EV's were so great, why do they need to be subsidized??

What's the scenario if fire is involved...?would have thought those batteries would be not great to be anywhere near in that situation..

 

[1dirthawker]

if fire is involved, with ANY vehicle you hope the victim is not in the vehicle or they are most likely gonna die before a fire dept even gets there.

otherwise, dangerous gasses (same as any vehicle fire) AND electricity. again, how the vehicle is struck and does that impingement act on the wiring determines how dangerous the potential situation is.

also, vehicles NEVER blow up for real like they do with almost every crash on TV!!

 

[sgt_zim]

Well said buddy,
One other curiosity is they only mention CO{2} whereas there are other gasses. Diesels have both particulate and NOx issues that are not always addressed. On the battery side, there are sulfur gasses that have to be captured.

Low CO{2} is nice but compared to what?

In what way is low CO2 nice? At 150 ppm, plant life ceases entirely. 300 ppm is only just enough. We are only just above that at about 420 ppm, and the planet is greening amazingly because of it. The more of my food's food that grows robustly, the more of my food I get to eat.

 

[AjFourie]

In S.A they are struggling to provide enough power as it is... Charging your new EV could take days.... I'll just hold on to my trusty diesel for the foreseeable future...

 

[Aaron N]

In what way is low CO2 nice? At 150 ppm, plant life ceases entirely. 300 ppm is only just enough. We are only just above that at about 420 ppm, and the planet is greening amazingly because of it. The more of my food's food that grows robustly, the more of my food I get to eat.

If high carbon means a return of mega floura and fauna, keep that coal cooking!