Pancontinental hunting list?

[WebleyGreene455]

This is my first proper thread, so please bear with me. These are what I've settled on acquiring/building for an all-around hunting "arsenal" that would be at home here in the USA as well as Africa, should I ever manage to get there, and I'd like to have y'all's thoughts on how viable it is.

>>Mauser Gew.98 sporter, 9.3x62mm (for anything on four legs short of a Cape Buffalo and/or large cat)
>>Mauser Gew.98 sporter, 7.92x57mm (for anything the 9.3mm might be a bit too powerful for)
>>C. Sharps 1885 High Wall, .450 Nitro Express (for anything the 9.3mm isn't powerful enough for or legally allowed to take)

Now, some of you may be saying, "Why a 1885 High Wall?" Well, the antiquarian and historian in me wanted something that would be the American single-shot equivalent of an old-fashioned double rifle, and after considering a Sharps 1874, a Remington-Hepburn, and a 1885 High-Wall, the High-Wall won out as the best candidate.

As for the Mausers, I love the German action, I love the German cartridges, and since both 8mm and 9.3mm have such long histories, I felt there was very little choice for me, personally, but to have them. A Ross or SMLE sporter in .303 Brit plus a P14/M1917 Enfield in .375H&H would be approximate equals to them(and not unwanted ones, at that), but the German ones are more appealing. The 9.3 build was initially conceived as an "explorer's rifle" inspired by real and fictional hunters, explorers, mercenaries, and "obtainers of rare antiquities" of the late 19th and early 20th centuries, and I'd be delighted to put it to proper use as a hunting weapon once I've finished it.

A final note: I have very little idea about what pistol laws/rules/regulations are throughout Africa; I have heard the "needs to have a scope" one for South Africa. And I'm curious about this because, at home in GA, I carry a sidearm with me nearly any time I go a-walking in the woods. We've got bears, snakes, puma, coyotes, wolves, gators, bobcats, down here, and while I've never had the misfortune to encounter any of the above (so far), I carry one all the same. I reckon I'd just feel all the better about having one on my hip overseas (or in the US) even if I was toting one of the aforementioned rifles. Choices for that, as far as I'm concerned, would be a double-action revolver of some kind, either a Colt New Service or one of my namesakes in .455 Webley (down here I typically go with a single-action sixgun in .44-40).

Kindest regards,
~~W.G.455

 

[Red Leg]

You don't get to carry a handgun for personal protection. You must live in a wilder part of Georgia than I have visited.

I assume you are talking about the C. Sharps made by the folks in Montana? I was unaware that they had managed a .450 Nitro Express in that rifle. I am little surprised because the action is designed to handle the big .40 BP rounds and a .450 NE is a different beast. Even if they did, it would not be on my recommendation list for a novice dangerous game hunter.

Both the 9.3x62 and the 8x57 (I assume you are referring to the .323 JS and not the .318) are fine well established cartridges. More a question of the rifles and optics than the rounds themselves. The 8x57 operates in the same range envelope as the '06, so you may find yourself wishing for a bit more reach in places like British Columbia and the mid-Asian mountains.

The 9.3 is a fine PG round in Africa (as would be the 8x57 - somewhat redundant for PG) and can in some locations be used legally for buffalo. Again, it will be more about the final set-up and optics.

 

[AZDAVE]

The 3 you mentioned will work on most anything. The 9.3 with solids will work on small kritters. and is the entry level in some countries for DG, and It is a great moose and bear round. The 8mm like a 30/06 has been harvesting game for over a 100 years. I find the Sharps interesting, have owned several 45/70-45/110. The 450NE will take anything on the planet, however it isn't the fastest single shot to get a second round loaded into and ready for a second shot. Hunting DG with a single shot isn't for everyone. I would recommend!!!! That you get buy in from the PH you will be hunting with so that he is good with your choice and is %100 percent on board with it. The other 4 round from a historical perspective you might consider in a mauser/enfield/Stuzen/ is 375H&H, 7x57, 6.5x54, 6.5x55.

As for a sidearm I have never taken one to Africa so can't help you on that part of your question.

 

[WebleyGreene455]

You don't get to carry a handgun for personal protection. You must live in a wilder part of Georgia than I have visited.

I assume you are talking about the C. Sharps made by the folks in Montana? I was unaware that they had managed a .450 Nitro Express in that rifle. I am little surprised because the action is designed to handle the big .40 BP rounds and a .450 NE is a different beast. Even if they did, it would not be on my recommendation list for a novice dangerous game hunter.

Both the 9.3x62 and the 8x57 (I assume you are referring to the .323 JS and not the .318) are fine well established cartridges. More a question of the rifles and optics than the rounds themselves. The 8x57 operates in the same range envelope as the '06, so you may find yourself wishing for a bit more reach in places like British Columbia and the mid-Asian mountains.

The 9.3 is a fine PG round in Africa (as would be the 8x57 - somewhat redundant for PG) and can in some locations be used legally for buffalo. Again, it will be more about the final set-up and optics.

C. Sharps in Montana, yes. They don't offer a .450NE but have told me they can build one for me should I want to. They (as well as Winchester at some point) do make a High Wall in .405 Winchester, though, and a Sharps as well; according to SAAMI specs, the .405 Win's max pressure is 46,000 PSI and the max pressure I've found for the .450 is ~44,200PSI, so I figured it would work.

But at the moment it's an idea rattling around in my head and I'm not committed to doing it just yet. I'm very much acutely aware that, as a novice DG hunter, it may very well not be a rifle I'd want to use even if doable. That's if I ever decided to do DG in the first place, of course.

 

[WebleyGreene455]

The 3 you mentioned will work on most anything. The 9.3 with solids will work on small kritters. and is the entry level in some countries for DG, and It is a great moose and bear round. The 8mm like a 30/06 has been harvesting game for over a 100 years. I find the Sharps interesting, have owned several 45/70-45/110. The 450NE will take anything on the planet, however it isn't the fastest single shot to get a second round loaded into and ready for a second shot. Hunting DG with a single shot isn't for everyone. I would recommend!!!! That you get buy in from the PH you will be hunting with so that he is good with your choice and is %100 percent on board with it. The other 4 round from a historical perspective you might consider in a mauser/enfield/Stuzen/ is 375H&H, 7x57, 6.5x54, 6.5x55.

As for a sidearm I have never taken one to Africa so can't help you on that part of your question.

Not a Sharps, a Winchester 1885 High Wall. Think of it like a more compact Sharps action with the hammer in the middle of the receiver instead and protected by "walls" that give the action more strength. Made from 1885 through 1918:
https://csharpsarms.com/catalog-detail/38/Model-1885-Highwall-Low-wall-Sporting-Rifle.html

I do know that the 9.3 is OK in some countries for DG, and not OK in others; that's something to take into account in the future but I think I'd be good with taking it everywhere as my #1 rifle anyway, since I don't know if I'd do DG or not in the end. I absolutely will make sure to settle everything with a PH when the time comes; I will not be going to Africa for quite a while (if ever), so I have plenty of time to get things sorted out. Which is why I'm here!

 

[BeeMaa]

@WebleyGreene455 , welcome to AH.

I will leave your choice of rifles and cartridges to those far more knowledgeable than I.
With people like @AZDAVE and @Red Leg giving you council, I personally would be listening.

As for a pistol or revolver for personal protection...you will not need it.
Your PH will be in charge of your security and although it's not legal for us to carry a pistol, rest assured they can and do.
Within an hour of arrival at JNB our PH almost cleared leather on a vagrant trying to roll us in the airport parking garage.
The PH's exact words were "I will shoot you in the face" while he had his hand on his pistol ready to throw down.
Needless to say, they take the safety and security of their clients seriously.
This was the only incident (or non-incident really) we had on our 11 day trip.

BTW - The PH also carried ALL THE TIME, in the bush, driving, at the airport...ALL THE TIME.
You will be well taken care of.

 

[WebleyGreene455]

@WebleyGreene455 , welcome to AH.

I will leave your choice of rifles and cartridges to those far more knowledgeable than I.
With people like @AZDAVE and @Red Leg giving you council, I personally would be listening.

As for a pistol or revolver for personal protection...you will not need it.
Your PH will be in charge of your security and although it's not legal for us to carry a pistol, rest assured they can and do.
Within an hour of arrival at JNB our PH almost cleared leather on a vagrant trying to roll us in the airport parking garage.
The PH's exact words were "I will shoot you in the face" while he had his hand on his pistol ready to throw down.
Needless to say, they take the safety and security of their clients seriously.
This was the only incident (or non-incident really) we had on our 11 day trip.

BTW - The PH also carried ALL THE TIME, in the bush, driving, at the airport...ALL THE TIME.
You will be well taken care of.

Fear not, I'm certainly listening. Came here for help, I'd be a fool not to listen.

 

[Mort Hill]

You yourself sound quite competent when it comes to firearms, and I certainly have never seen a wish list like yours for the purpose of covering all the African bases so to speak. Quite unique. This is a very interesting thread, and as @BeeMaa stated, you have a wealth of wisdom already responding to your thread. Keep up the questions as I love seeing the variety of answers.

 

[cmk]

I have no ideas on the Sharps/Winchester rifle, as we don't see them all that much on this side. As have been mentioned, though, single shot and DG sounds .. interesting.

Personally, I would maybe prefer a 7x57 as a companion to the 9.3. Still very much German, and with all the military and sporting history to go along with it.

 

[WebleyGreene455]

I have no ideas on the Sharps/Winchester rifle, as we don't see them all that much on this side. As have been mentioned, though, single shot and DG sounds .. interesting.

Personally, I would maybe prefer a 7x57 as a companion to the 9.3. Still very much German, and with all the military and sporting history to go along with it.

Hi cmk. No, the Sharps and 1885 don't seem to have been so popular on the far side of the Atlantic, but that's hardly surprising considering all the British and continental gunmakers producing single and double rifles at the time. The falling block action it uses was popular enough, though; best British example I can think of is the Farquharson rifle. I see you're in and/or from Sweden; y'all used a lot of Remington rolling blocks over there once upon a time and I see a fair number of them on websites but I've never been too interested in the rolling block action.

The 7x57 wasn't one I'd really considered but as a companion to a heavier rifle like a 9.3 I could see the appeal. Thanks for the suggestion.