Winchester Pre-64 Model 70 Supergrade African 458 (1956)

[Rowbeeone]

I have a friend trying to sell this rifle. I need to get more pics, but going to post it here at the advice of @CZDiesel.

Is there any interest in this rifle?

 

[RLL]

There could be interest…Posts require a price at minimum.

Would be nice to hear about rifle specs, LoP, barrel length, and year of manufacture, modifications, etc…

 

[Mekaniks]

List a price and post more pics and details.....

 

[gbflyer]

I’d be interested in seeing the cretin that put the muzzle brake on that fine rifle being horse whipped.

 

[Denvir Tire]

Yes, I'm interested.....

 

[deewayne2003]

I have a friend trying to sell this rifle. I need to get more pics, but going to post it here at the advice of @CZDiesel.

Is there any interest in this rifle?View attachment 668243View attachment 668244View attachment 668245

I think so - I would be interested…..but is that a muzzle brake at the end of the barrel?

 

[Rowbeeone]

Winchester Pre-64 Model 70 Supergrade African 458 (1956)​

It is part of an estate sale that we are helping out with. I just got some better pictures. I'm going to post them. I think the rules state I have to list a price, but still trying to get some help with a figure, so for now 8k-10k (negotiable). Let me know what you think.

 

[375er]

I think you will lucky to get half of that price, at best.

 

[RR 314]

I think you will lucky to get half of that price, at best.

Agreed. Collector value is in unmolested state.. This has been butchered and set reasonable expectations with the estate. Likely 9-10K original. Butchered value is likely 4-6K.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

Winchester Pre-64 Model 70 Supergrade African 458 (1956)
It is part of an estate sale that we are helping out with. I just got some better pictures. I'm going to post them. I think the rules state I have to list a price, but still trying to get some help with a figure, so for now 8k-10k (negotiable). Let me know what you think.

Whatever that thing on the end of the barrel isn't right on a .458 Supergrade!
Also, the gouge on the front sight speeks volumes as to this rifle's life.

I like the receiver sight but... there is an extra crossbolt or something holding the stock together.

Here's the other side with the same extra crossbolt thing.
That's also a lot, I mean a lot of extra checkering!

Have the bolt handle and bottom metal had all the blueing polished off them?

This Supergrade has a butchered barrel and a butchered stock along with no blueing left on the bolt handle and bottom metal.

Only because this was a M70 .458 Win Supergrade, it may sell at $3,000. List it for $4,000 and wait for a bite, and wait... The same rifle in same condition in .375 H&H would bring $2,000 on a good day.

I wonder what @rookhawk will say about this one?

 

[Mekaniks]

Any collector value is gone. Someone may pick it for a “shooter” or for a custom build donor….

 

[rookhawk]

Whatever that thing on the end of the barrel isn't right on a .458 Supergrade!
Also, the gouge on the front sight speeks volumes as to this rifle's life.
View attachment 671265

I like the receiver sight but... there is an extra crossbolt or something holding the stock together.
View attachment 671266

Here's the other side with the same extra crossbolt thing.
That's also a lot, I mean a lot of extra checkering!
View attachment 671267

Have the bolt handle and bottom metal had all the blueing polished off them?
View attachment 671268

This Supergrade has a butchered barrel and a butchered stock along with no blueing let on the bolt handle and bottom metal.

Only because this was a M70 .458 Win Supergrade, it may sell at $3,000. List it for $4,000 and wait for a bite, and wait... The same rifle in same condition in .375 H&H would bring $2,000 on a good day.

I wonder what @rookhawk will say about this one?

You are 100% correct. As a terrible investment, someone will buy it for $3000 which is an awful decision. They'll restore all the metal, polishing out the chips. They'll remove the muzzle brake. They'll try to conceal it with a muzzle cap. They'll then spend a fortune on a worthless replica stock. In the end, they'll have $5000+ into it and it will be worth $4200ish for a restored and reworked pre-64 super in 458.

If the rifle has a bobbed barrel already, then its a grimmer picture than I've painted.

Postscript: This is predicated on it having the rear sight on the barrel (worth $500 alone) and that someone would TIG weld the aperture sight screws closed during resto unless that year had them by default, in which case they'd plug them. The aperture sight has to go.

 

[RR 314]

Admittedly, and embarrassingly, I missed the third crossbolt. Just saw the other obvious butchering. Again, set realistic expectations with the estate. My evaluation has gone lower. Significantly lower.

 

[TSIBINDI]

...In forty plus years of buying and selling Model 70's, I have never seen a more butchered example.
Originally Winchester produced 1226 Africans. With this iteration, there is, for sure, one less.

 

[Jack Stevens]

I think you will lucky to get half of that price, at best.

Especially with the muzzle brake. Not sure if it’s detachable (can’t tell from the pics), but it kills the original profile of the barrel.

Plus, MBs are detested by PHs and their staffs if you actually take it over to Africa to hunt with.

 

[375er]

You are 100% correct. As a terrible investment, someone will buy it for $3000 which is an awful decision. They'll restore all the metal, polishing out the chips. They'll remove the muzzle brake. They'll try to conceal it with a muzzle cap. They'll then spend a fortune on a worthless replica stock. In the end, they'll have $5000+ into it and it will be worth $4200ish for a restored and reworked pre-64 super in 458.

If the rifle has a bobbed barrel already, then its a grimmer picture than I've painted.

Postscript: This is predicated on it having the rear sight on the barrel (worth $500 alone) and that someone would TIG weld the aperture sight screws closed during resto unless that year had them by default, in which case they'd plug them. The aperture sight has to go.

I would have to say the barrel has been cut and threaded for the muzzelbreak. I have never seen one before that is clearly under the front sight. To remove the break you would have to cut more off the barrel then re-drill and tap to mount the front sight in correct position to the muzzle.
With all the de-ducts....$1500 ??????

 

[375er]

Also the action appears to be a matte finish and the barrel glossy. Clearly reworked from original. Many questions.

 

[Mtn_Infantry]

...In forty plus years of buying and selling Model 70's, I have never seen a more butchered example.
Originally Winchester produced 1226 Africans. With this iteration, there is, for sure, one less.

Listen to this man on Model 70’s!!

@Rowbeeone you should prepare the estate to get about $2k. Their best bet is listing this on Gun Broker and letting bidders have at it/hoping someone gets caught-up in the moment.

Below are the things I notice at first glance which detract from value, but also make me think might be a forgery of a Pre64 African Super Grade or a parts gun meant to look like one

Muzzle break/barrel threading, barrel looks a touch to short as well - What’s the date code on the barrel do the Winchester marks line-up?

Missing rear sight - has plug screws

Bolt and bottom metal are polished. Does the serial number match? Was the jeweling of the bolt possibly done after?

Incorrect/non factory trigger

Front sight has been removed/reinstalled
Front sight is missing the hood, and I believe that’s the incorrect front sight insert for an African Super Grade from 56 (wouldn’t surprise me if they went with one from a 375 because of the peep vs irons)

Stock has an extra crossbolt, is missing the supergrade sling swivel mount
The checkering is incorrect on pistol grip (see photo below comparing it to another)
Doesn’t appear to have the correct grip cap
Should have a red buttpad not the one it wears
I’d need to look closer but overall the checkering looks off, does it have the right number squares per inch?
Comb/cheek piece on the stock looks incorrect (see photos below)
All this makes me wonder if it’s an attempt at a reproduction stock

Again, these are just the things that jump out to me at first glance. If the gun were in my hand I’d likely find some other issues.

 

[Hillcountry63]

As unfortunate as it is, I'd be hard pressed to even bid on this, even if it sold for a $1000. Too many issues........

 

[BJH65]

Agree with all of the above assessments on this rifle. It is what one would call a “shooter” with no collector value. Not sure if any wood was removed on the stock where the aperture sight is mounted? Oftentimes it is. I would remove the muzzle break, appears threaded, screw in a thread protector and call it a day.

Not uncommon for these rifles to have “period correction modifications” like Griffin & Howe side mounts but even they can lower the value. Anyways, the rifle is a shooter, perfectly fine to take to Africa and beat the hell out of it.