.458 Super X factory ammo question

[Badboymelvin]

Hey guys,

I am planning for my first trip to Africa and am planning on hunting the following animals,

• Gemsbok - my absolute favourite animal in the world
• Blue Wildebeest - because I can't afford Buffalo!
• Kudu - because I have too, it's Africa!
• Warthog - because... just because!

I might add an animal or 2, but these are the main ones.
I'm also planning on taking my 2 rifles with me,

• Weatherby Vanguard - .300 Weatherby Magnum - 180gn Woodleigh@ 3070fps average
• Zastava M70 - .458 Winchester Magnum - 510gn Powerpoint@ 2015fps average

My idea is to use the .300 on the Gemsbok, Kudu and Warthog and the .458 on the Wildebeest.
The .300 Weatherby is a hand-load of mine, but the .458 is factory ammo.
I managed to track down some .458 factory ammo, the red & white box Super X with the 510gn Powerpoint.
The idea was to shoot it all off as quickly as possible so I could reload the empty shells.

But when I chronographed the factory stuff it averaged 2015fps which I thought was pretty good.
(On a side note, this is the first time I've ever got over 2000fps with factory .458 ammo. I've always got 1950-1975fps so I was happy that this was really close to the quoted velocity - 2040fps)

But then that got me thinking, 510gn @ 2015fps is a pretty potent load delivering 4600ft/lbs of energy. Maybe I should use this on the Wildebeest instead of the reload I had planned?
My usual load in the .458 is the 480gn Woodleigh RNSP @ 2150fps and it is both powerful and accurate, but I'm afraid nostalgia is kicking in and I am really wanting to use this old Super X stuff in Africa?

So I guess after all that (sorry guys!), for the people that have used it, how did the Super X 510gn perform on game? Especially on game the approx size of Wildebeest?

Now, I know that I can use the .300 on EVERYTHING, but the .458 is my absolute favourite caliber and my dream has always been to use it in Africa.
But alas, I can't afford Buff or Ele so Blue Wildebeest it is! And I've heard that Wildebeest are notoriously tough so I don't feel to foolish about using it...

Would really appreciate your feedback guys and thanks for putting up with my long post!

Cheers,

Russ

 

[cagkt3]

Give it hell!

Honestly, as you said, the 300 would cover BW. I have shot BW with 30-06 (and my wife shot one with a 270 Win). But that 458 would probably do a number on it - take a video if you can!!

 

[shark_za]

Plan on using the .458 for all shorter shots, warthog, Blue Wildebeest and maybe Kudu.
The 300 for anything longer, see what the terrain is like. Usually Gemsbok are shot at longer ranges and Kudu is often take across valleys in some areas.
The .458 makes a great bushveld caliber if you can handle the recoil; its not explosive but makes biggish holes on both sides. I don't think you will see a difference between it and the 45/70 that I have used quite a bit. I tend to like deep penetration for reliable killing even if it does not seem as decisive and sudden like with other high velocity calibers.
ps, my 45/70 dropped a wildebeest on a frontal shot quicker than anything I have ever taken one with and you could "eat up to the hole"; a factor I like as I hunt for meat.

 

[CJW]

Any chance you could shoot one or two into some water jugs or newspaper to see how they hold together and mushroom?

 

[Badboymelvin]

Any chance you could shoot one or two into some water jugs or newspaper to see how they hold together and mushroom?

That is a FANTASTIC idea!!

 

[Wyatt Smith]

Please post pictures of the bullets.

 

[Badboymelvin]

Hey guys,

I forgot I had these! I fired these YEARS ago...

Here are a couple of fired projectiles that completely penetrated a large gum tree at a range of about 15 meters.

I'll never forget this occasion because it was the first time I EVER fired a .458!
The largest rifle I had ever fired before this was a .303 British.
And when I fired the .458 I flinched so hard I nearly threw the rifle out of my arms!

These are the 2 510gn SuperX factory ammo projectiles that were fired out of a hogsback CZ550 with the 25" barrel.
Velocity would've been around 2000fps...

On a drizzly day, myself and my brother-in-law fired 2 shots at a large gum tree about 15 meters away.
When we walked up to the tree to checked out the damage, we found one of the projectiles laying on the ground a few inches behind the tree.
And when I pulled the bark off the back of the same tree, the second projectile fell out!

So there you go, not very scientific - but I think still pretty impressive from a factory soft point...

Keep posted guys and as soon as I can get out in the bush again I'll fire a couple into some wet newsprint.

Cheers,

Russ

 

[CJW]

Very cool. Definitely held together better than I thought they would considering they were shot into a tree. Should do well in some non DG but I'm no expert.

 

[Badboymelvin]

Very cool. Definitely held together better than I thought they would considering they were shot into a tree. Should do well in some non DG but I'm no expert.

Hey mate,

I have just weighed the 2 projectiles (I can't believe I've never done this before!) and they weighed in at 450.2gns and 490.7gn respectively.
Absolutely FANTASTIC performance in my opinion considering the cost...

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of premium, bonded bullets (Woodleigh's being a favourite), but maybe, just maybe sometimes we get to caught up in the whole 'premium', 'bonded', 'all-copper' bullet craze and forget that the old stand-by 'Core-lokt' and 'Powerpoint' can still get the job done...

 

[shark_za]

At .458 velocity on thin skinned game, any bullet will work.
The softer the better actually.

 

[CJW]

Hey mate,

I have just weighed the 2 projectiles (I can't believe I've never done this before!) and they weighed in at 450.2gns and 490.7gn respectively.
Absolutely FANTASTIC performance in my opinion considering the cost...

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of premium, bonded bullets (Woodleigh's being a favourite), but maybe, just maybe sometimes we get to caught up in the whole 'premium', 'bonded', 'all-copper' bullet craze and forget that the old stand-by 'Core-lokt' and 'Powerpoint' can still get the job done...

I bought an FN built 458wm last year and actually just got around to shooting it so it's nice to see what a lighter built and cheaper bullet does. I bought some ammo from reeds ammo with 350 gr soft points and they shoot so well I've been curious about how they hold up. I'd really like to take an eland with it someday.

Looking forward to the newsprint photos.

Cheers

 

[Major Khan]

I bought an FN built 458wm last year and actually just got around to shooting it so it's nice to see what a lighter built and cheaper bullet does. I bought some ammo from reeds ammo with 350 gr soft points and they shoot so well I've been curious about how they hold up. I'd really like to take an eland with it someday.

Looking forward to the newsprint photos.

Cheers

You made an excellent purchase ! What vintage is your Fabrique Nationale .458 Winchester magnum calibre bolt rifle ?
Is it a pre 1965 control round feed action model ? Or 1 of the later push feed models with the lack of a bolt guide ?

 

[Major Khan]

Melvin , you most probably acquired post 1978 Winchester " Super X " ammunition . In the .458 Winchester magnum calibre ... these advertised a velocity of 2040 feet per second , by utilizing Olin powder.
Due to the age of the ammunition .... You encountered a ( very negligible ) reduction in velocity by 25 feet per second .
I would worry , if I were the wildebeest .
Your ammunition shall be more than adequate for non dangerous game the size of a wildebeest . Do keep us posted !
You shall not be let down.

 

[mikecatt13]

I wouldnt use Winchester if they paid for my entire safari. The PowerPoint super X are the exact bullet that failed on me multiple times that caused me to never buy another Winchester product.

Long story short, they fragment even on soft tissue. My wife shot a deer perfectly (no bone) and it failed. How do I know? Switched her to Hornady and killed the same deer a year later and i recovered the bullet, actually just a jacket just under the skin on the ENTRANCE side. Winchester knows about the problem and wont recall the bullets because it's too expensive, they were rather rude when I told them i recovered it and had evidence of the failure

I'm not lying when I say if they offered a full bag 21 day safari and HAD to use their ammo I wouldnt go, and that's not something I can afford on my own. Absolute garbage product backed by an unethical company

 

[CJW]

You made an excellent purchase ! What vintage is your Fabrique Nationale .458 Winchester magnum calibre bolt rifle ?
Is it a pre 1965 control round feed action model ? Or 1 of the later push feed models with the lack of a bolt guide ?

Early 60's CRF. It's a lovely rifle. I found many other makes of 458 for much less money but when I saw this one I bought it right away. It already has an African pedigree, just not with me.

 

[postoak]

First, I don't think Blue Wildebeest are notoriously tough to kill. Second, if I was really in to nostalgia, I'd want to duplicate the old .450 NE loads which were, IIRC, 480 grain bullets at 2150 fps. Third, unless you are a really good shot off of sticks, I'd restrict shots to 150 yards or less, fourth, the .458 WM has a sufficiently flat trajectory to shoot out to 150 yards and if you are willing to memorize drop figures you can go out further. Fifth, I forgot your original question, but you don't need to feel foolish using the .458 WM on everything.

Animals I would recommend: kudu and gemsbok because of the magnificent horns, warthog and impala because of the low trophy prices, and Blue Wildebeest and zebra because they are so iconic.

 

[IvW]

Forget about the .458WM......

 

[Major Khan]

Forget about the .458WM......

IvW, I loathe the .458 Winchester magnum calibre for dangerous game as much as you do ( probably more , because my professional shikaree partner lost a kidney after getting gored by a gaur bison which was wounded by a client's .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifle ) . However , is it even a poor choice for non dangerous African game ?

 

[CJW]

Fifth, I forgot your original question, but you don't need to feel foolish using the .458 WM on everything.

Agreed! That's my plan and I don't feel foolish about it at all.

I will say that if you want a hard hunt like a buffalo hunt you might consider an eland as your main quarry. I've read about people comparing them to buffalo because of putting in many miles, days on end in search of an old blue bull. They hunt them in much the same way usually and don't stay still very long. You certainly won't look foolish using a 458 on those big brutes. 2000 pounds justifies a 500 gr bullet.

 

[CJW]

IvW, I loathe the .458 Winchester magnum calibre for dangerous game as much as you do ( probably more , because my professional shikaree partner lost a kidney after getting gored by a gaur bison which was wounded by a client's .458 Winchester magnum calibre rifle ) . However , is it even a poor choice for non dangerous African game ?

No offense guys but can we not turn this into a 458wm bashing or debate thread? He already has the rifle and plans on using it.

Thanks