Buckshot through fixed full choke

[Hoss Delgado]

I will be buying another BRNO gun in five weeks from now. It's an over under 12 gauge with 2 3/4 inch Chambers. The barrels have fixed full chokes . I am buying this gun because l plan to take it to Africa for my 2020 Safari for some wing shooting when I'm not after the plains game . I realized that my 10 gauge Browning semi auto " Gold " shotgun may not be legally allowed there.
Here is the thing : l want to be able to shoot buckshot through it as well (00 and 000 ) . In the US , l sometimes take deer with a shotgun and the ability to shoot buckshot is very important to me.
I was told by both my dad and my Granddad that Buckshot fired through a fixed full choke is very bad for the gun. Is this true ?
Thanks ,
Hoss.
P.S : In my Browning , l typically use an IC choke for buckshot.

 

[BRICKBURN]

Here's a choke comparison for you.
https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-44-shotgun-chokes-and-buckshot/


Steel shot, never through a full choke.

Lead, I have not had issues.

 

[Red Leg]

I would not shoot buckshot through a full choke. Smaller shot is relatively easily constricted - much more difficult as it increases in size. In an OU you are complicating the issue due to barrel soldering, regulation, etc. Even if you don’t bell a barrel or split the rib soldering, really large shot typically responds best to less constriction.

Am curious why full choke? It is an expert’s choice due to pattern size. If you shoot full choke well, then fine, but the ideal game gun for me is something pretty open on one of those two barrels. Otherwise, it sort of defeats the purpose of having the option in the first place. My favorite English game guns, like most made over the last 100+ years are typically choked what we would call skeet or IC in one barrel and IM or full in the other. In my fairly extensive wing shooting experience, targets seem to be near or far - often in the same flock or covey.

I do shoot full & full a lot (couple thousand rounds a year) but that is with fairly specialized OUs and SxS’s in competitive pigeon shooting. A bird that staggers to the ground just outside the ring is as lost as a miss. So we hit them with 1 1/4 ounce high velocity loads from tightly choked guns. Quite a bit of money can be on the line. But I would rarely opt for one of those guns for a day in the field.

I also don’t have much use for buckshot. Slugs can be devastatingly effective from a well set up smooth bore. I have a William Evans Paradox that shoots 740 gr “slugs” like a double rifle and perfect modified patterns from each barrel. It has rolled warthogs and piled up sand grouse from the same waterhole in Namibia. Buck shot, on the other hand, has a long track record at wounding game - particularly 1 1/4 ounce loads from a 2 3/4 inch shell. I assume you have had success with your big 10 and buckshot. I think I would leave the buckshot hunting for it.

 

[BnC 04]

I've used buck in my full choke for years on coyote coming to decoy. Never an issue and patterns perfectly for my usage.

 

[Hoss Delgado]

I would not shoot buckshot through a full choke. Smaller shot is relatively easily constricted - much more difficult as it increases in size. In an OU you are complicating the issue due to barrel soldering, regulation, etc. Even if you don’t bell a barrel or split the rib soldering, really large shot typically responds best to less constriction.

Am curious why full choke? It is an expert’s choice due to pattern size. If you shoot full choke well, then fine, but the ideal game gun for me is something pretty open on one of those two barrels. Otherwise, it sort of defeats the purpose of having the option in the first place. My favorite English game guns, like most made over the last 100+ years are typically choked what we would call skeet or IC in one barrel and IM or full in the other. In my fairly extensive wing shooting experience, targets seem to be near or far - often in the same flock or covey.

I do shoot full & full a lot (couple thousand rounds a year) but that is with fairly specialized OUs and SxS’s in competitive pigeon shooting. A bird that staggers to the ground just outside the ring is as lost as a miss. So we hit them with 1 1/4 ounce high velocity loads from tightly choked guns. Quite a bit of money can be on the line. But I would rarely opt for one of those guns for a day in the field.

I also don’t have much use for buckshot. Slugs can be devastatingly effective from a well set up smooth bore. I have a William Evans Paradox that shoots 740 gr “slugs” like a double rifle and perfect modified patterns from each barrel. It has rolled warthogs and piled up sand grouse from the same waterhole in Namibia. Buck shot, on the other hand, has a long track record at wounding game - particularly 1 1/4 ounce loads from a 2 3/4 inch shell. I assume you have had success with your big 10 and buckshot. I think I would leave the buckshot hunting for it.

Red Leg , you ask some very sensible questions. Let me answer you in length. Up until very recently , l have been using my 10 gauge Browning semi auto for all my fowl shooting using multi chokes.
I couldn't be happier with the gun. But l was told that some African countries don't allow semi auto shotguns. So l quickly started looking for an alternative. I respect side by sides . But they are not for me . I always got more accurate results with an over under. Especially since l can accurately shoot slugs with the top barrel . So l started looking for a good second hand over under and got my hands on a BRNO with fixed full chokes which fit my budget. I've used fixed full choke Beretta Over Unders before for goose shooting ( but to be fair l was using 3 inch shells ) at 40-45 yards with good results.
I know that l can't shoot slugs through a full choke. But l was hoping l could use buckshot on it for wart hog or African antelope which are small.

 

[Hoss Delgado]

I've used buck in my full choke for years on coyote coming to decoy. Never an issue and patterns perfectly for my usage.

What gun ?

 

[Hogpatrol]

With the proper paperwork done well in advance, you can take a semi-auto shotgun to RSA. I don't know about getting 10 gauge ammo though. As far as buckshot, except for the special regulations areas, it's banned for deer hunting in Pennsylvania, one of the top deer hunting states. Different strokes and I don't know what you plan on hunting in Africa but with most game from this chair, a shotgun with slugs or buckshot is a non starter.

 

[Hoss Delgado]

With the proper paperwork done well in advance, you can take a semi-auto shotgun to RSA. I don't know about getting 10 gauge ammo though. As far as buckshot, except for the special regulations areas, it's banned for deer hunting in Pennsylvania, one of the top deer hunting states.

It's useful in a few shotgun- only areas.

 

[LivingTheDream]

I have found buckshot to be extremely effective on deer. It definitively has its limitations but in certain situations it is extremely effective. I did use 3 1/2 in 00buck when deer hunting though.

I think the bigger issue people have with buckshot is that it is really only necessary in certain situations. Close encounters in thick areas, most of the ones I shot were within 30 yards. The other think I think some people do wrong is they aim in the traditional vital area, where as the neck/head is much more effective and eliminates a lot of tracking.

I would love to go jump duikers with a shotgun and buck shot!!! It would be like rabbit hunting on Steriods!

 

[Red Leg]

Red Leg , you ask some very sensible questions. Let me answer you in length. Up until very recently , l have been using my 10 gauge Browning semi auto for all my fowl shooting using multi chokes.
I couldn't be happier with the gun. But l was told that some African countries don't allow semi auto shotguns. So l quickly started looking for an alternative. I respect side by sides . But they are not for me . I always got more accurate results with an over under. Especially since l can accurately shoot slugs with the top barrel . So l started looking for a good second hand over under and got my hands on a BRNO with fixed full chokes which fit my budget. I've used fixed full choke Beretta Over Unders before for goose shooting ( but to be fair l was using 3 inch shells ) at 40-45 yards with good results.
I know that l can't shoot slugs through a full choke. But l was hoping l could use buckshot on it for wart hog or African antelope which are small.

Thanks for the reply Hoss.

I would not use buckshot on any African PG. Warthog can be pretty tough and getting close enough to them or any antelope would be a challenge. Further, remember a drop of blood equals a trophy fee. A shotgun does work on some of the little guys in thick woodland such as blue duiker. But in that case a load of number 4’s or maybe 2’s are best. Think something the size of a European hare. Though, I have killed all mine easily with a rifle.

You could sit over a waterhole in an archery blind and get something close enough to probably kill it with a shotgun - but to what purpose?

 

[Hoss Delgado]

Thanks for the reply Hoss.

I would not use buckshot on any African PG. Warthog can be pretty tough and getting close enough to them or any antelope would be a challenge. Further, remember a drop of blood equals a trophy fee. A shotgun does work on some of the little guys in thick woodland such as blue duiker. But in that case a load of number 4’s or maybe 2’s are best. Think something the size of a European hare. Though, I have killed all mine easily with a rifle.

You could sit over a waterhole in an archery blind and get something close enough to probably kill it with a shotgun - but to what purpose?

4s and 2s ? You mean birdshot can be used effectively on Duiker ?!

 

[LivingTheDream]

4s and 2s ? You mean birdshot can be used effectively on Duiker ?!

Blue Duikers are tiny, like really tiny.

 

[Red Leg]

The only ones I have seen hunted with a shotgun were the blue in coastal Mozambique. I assume one could do the same with Suni, though I know of no one who has done so. Also, in West Africa shotguns are often used in the dense jungle for various forest duiker that are typically called in. The PH’s shotgun that he loaned for blues was a Turkish OU of some form using a load of 1 1/8 ounce number 5’s. Very effective on an antelope the size of a hare, and far too small a target for a load of buckshot. As I said previously, all of the various duiker that I have taken (and a Suni) were shot with a rifle - a 300 gr .375 solid to be precise.

Moreover, the duiker I have taken have been longer shots than I would try with a shotgun, though I have yet to take blue. The Suni and Red below, for instance, were both taken at about sixty yards. The blue is a bit smaller than The Suni and half the size of a red.

Mozambique Suni

• Red Leg
• Oct 16, 2017

Mozambique Red Duiker

• Red Leg
• Oct 16, 2017

 

[Odinsraven]

IMHO Warthog and Shotguns do not mix they are a tough bugger have shot a few dozen of them culling I would suggest at a min 7x57 or better 64 - hit one with an 8mm rem mag - 250 gr slug - perfect shot - bugger still made 30 yards ........

I friend spent the best part of a week to get an ostrich with a shotgun - started as a bar joke where I said I was exhausted decoying Ostrich - so my buddy decided he would take one with a shotgun !

 

[Hoss Delgado]

Blue Duikers are tiny, like really tiny.

Well , l see what you guys mean. When l hunted roe deer in Sweden , l picked up the tactic of using #1 birdshot when hunting roe deer with dogs . My friends there invariably use a 12 gauge Over Under with a 3 inch chamber , loaded with #1 shot for roe deer. At close range #1 birdshot will completely pole axe a deer.

 

[Hoss Delgado]

IMHO Warthog and Shotguns do not mix they are a tough bugger have shot a few dozen of them culling I would suggest at a min 7x57 or better 64 - hit one with an 8mm rem mag - 250 gr slug - perfect shot - bugger still made 30 yards ........

I friend spent the best part of a week to get an ostrich with a shotgun - started as a bar joke where I said I was exhausted decoying Ostrich - so my buddy decided he would take one with a shotgun !

I got a beautiful .350 Rigby Magnum built on a ZKK602 action that would pole axe them well in that case

 

[Hoss Delgado]

I have heard most of your experienced replies and l have concluded that buckshot ( especially 000 ) should not be fired from an over under or side by side with fixed full chokes
And further more , l also won't be using the O/U for anything other than fowl.
I will use my .350 Rigby Magnum for Warthog and Duiker along with the rest of my plains game.
It's a shame that full choked double barrels can't be used for buckshot though

 

[IvW]

So I cannot shoot original Brenneke slugs through my full choke 12ga/7x64R combo or my full choke 12ga/9.3x74R combo or my Brno sidelock which use to be 3/4 and full now 24 inch?

Shite I am going to have to stop hunting bush pigs over bait, stop hunting them in the corn fields and macadamia nut plantations at night, stop hunting them over hounds.......

I cant do that gonna keep shooting slugs through them as I have for many years ....never ever had an issue.

Biggest useful shot(call it buckshot if you want) for PG(smaller duikers) is AAA then straight to slugs(Brenneke originals). SG, SSG & LG lack penetration.

 

[Hogpatrol]

So I cannot shoot original Brenneke slugs through my full choke 12ga/7x64R combo or my full choke 12ga/9.3x74R combo or my Brno sidelock which use to be 3/4 and full now 24 inch?

Shite I am going to have to stop hunting bush pigs over bait, stop hunting them in the corn fields and macadamia nut plantations at night, stop hunting them over hounds.......

I cant do that gonna keep shooting slugs through them as I have for many years ....never ever had an issue.

Biggest useful shot(call it buckshot if you want) for PG(smaller duikers) is AAA then straight to slugs(Brenneke originals). SG, SSG & LG lack penetration.

@IvW, The discussion is on buckshot. Slugs are a different matter. Before I got a dedicated slug gun (rifled barrel), I shot slugs through a full choke, smooth bore Ithaca Model 37. Brenneke and other manufacturer's slugs are made to be used by anybody in any gun anywhere in the world without blowing up.
Aside that, accuracy with a smooth bore suffers with a full choke.

 

[ChrisG]

The issue with firing buckshot through a full choke has more to do, I think, with the misconception that, because it makes burdshot pattern tighter, it should do the same for buckshot. Unfortunately that's just not the case. Slamming large, round, soft lead balls through a constriction deforms them, sometimes horribly. Round shot holds a pattern, deformed shot does not. The best chokes, as a rule of thumb, to fire buck through to get a decent pattern, are cylinder and improved cylinder. You may find some will pattern throuvh a full choke but they are the exception rather than the rule. Also, you will usually find that lower velocity buck patterns the tightest, while magnum loads tend to string out a bit.