CEB solids in .375 ?

[BobT]

Anybody shooting the 300 grain CEB solids in .375? I'm thinking of trying them for my upcoming buff hunt. I'm wondering specifically about handloading them, I haven't been able to come up with any data yet.

 

[Pheroze]

CEB was able to give me load data for their safari Raptor in .411 so I bet they have something for the solid 375. They are good folks to deal with. Btw, check out their Raptor for your buff hunt. I have no personal experience with their effect but I have heard good things. Good luck!

 

[Royal27]

@PaulT ?

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Anybody shooting the 300 grain CEB solids in .375? I'm thinking of trying them for my upcoming buff hunt. I'm wondering specifically about handloading them, I haven't been able to come up with any data yet.

I've worked with them in my .458B&M only. As Pheroze said, drop them and email and they'll provide you plenty of data in short order.

They're a little different to work with with the bore rider design. Pay attention to the seating information they provide on their website. Not a big deal, you'll get it once you start working with them.

 

[fourfive8]

I always try to use several sources for loading any bullet. For these banded monometal solids I use other banded monometal data like that provided by Barnes and GS Custom. I pick a suitable powder and begin with loads 5-10% below max and go to the range with a chronograph. I check for pressure signs against velocity and check accuracy. So far, all these modern banded monometals have acted very predictably without surprise.

One thing about the CEB bullets, when loaded, the shank will have only 2 or 3 drive bands to engage the neck for neck tension- the compromise for reducing bore stress and pressure. Be sure to use a good crimp in the proper location (in a crimp groove and up against drive band) to avoid bullet set back during recoil. I use a Lee Factory Crimp Die to crimp all my hunting ammo. Here's a 450 gr .458 CEB FN Solid in a 45o Watts showing crimp.

 

[PaulT]

As others here have correctly stated seating the Raptors properly is important to achieve proper neck tension.

The pic provided above shows a correctly seated Raptor.
Crimped above the second top band.

During the evolution and design of the Raptors I was in a position to be the outfitter in Australia where the two main individuals responsible for the design of the bullet came to do a lot of the field testing and experimenting.

Over the course of several extended herd management/cull hunts we took in excess of 100 buffalo and an assortment of other game including feral cattle and wild boar with numerous different calibers and cartridges.

The CEB Safari Raptor is, by some margin, the most effective, reliable and consistently performing thick skinned projectile I have seen and used on buffalo sized game.

Entry holes are "cut clean" and remain open, kind of like cut with a leather punch, provided an egress point for a blood trail (if that is required).
Impact is dramatic as the blades shear departing from the main base in a centrifical pattern destroying tissue away from the main projectile base and drawing more blood flow to the exit/entry holes.
Penetration is at least as good if not better than any other projectile I have ever seen and STRAIGHT every time.

Personally, I have taken in excess of three dozen bovines, buffalo and feral cattle as well as feral hogs and numbers of feral horses, with both .50 cal and .510 cal Safari Raptors and would never consider hunting either with anything else. Period.

Others mileage may vary.

Contact CEB for loading data, they are very helpful people.

 

[PaulT]

I realize that I omitted a very important point in my above post.

The CEB Safari Raptors are NOT magical.
They still need to be placed correctly and properly for them to perform as they were designed.

A Safari Raptor in the guts is as lethal as a slap with a wet tissue.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

As others here have correctly stated seating the Raptors properly is important to achieve proper neck tension.

The pic provided above shows a correctly seated Raptor.
Crimped above the second top band.

During the evolution and design of the Raptors I was in a position to be the outfitter in Australia where the two main individuals responsible for the design of the bullet came to do a lot of the field testing and experimenting.

Over the course of several extended herd management/cull hunts we took in excess of 100 buffalo and an assortment of other game including feral cattle and wild boar with numerous different calibers and cartridges.

The CEB Safari Raptor is, by some margin, the most effective, reliable and consistently performing thick skinned projectile I have seen and used on buffalo sized game.

Entry holes are "cut clean" and remain open, kind of like cut with a leather punch, provided an egress point for a blood trail (if that is required).
Impact is dramatic as the blades shear departing from the main base in a centrifical pattern destroying tissue away from the main projectile base and drawing more blood flow to the exit/entry holes.
Penetration is at least as good if not better than any other projectile I have ever seen and STRAIGHT every time.

Personally, I have taken in excess of three dozen bovines, buffalo and feral cattle as well as feral hogs and numbers of feral horses, with both .50 cal and .510 cal Safari Raptors and would never consider hunting either with anything else. Period.

Others mileage may vary.

Contact CEB for loading data, they are very helpful people.

Paul,

We have certainly over the years discussed the Raptors on several occasions. I have only used the 260gr version in my .458B&M on PG and one lioness. And it is quite devastating. Inspection of the animals after the shot, can say I never saw anything like that in any other bullet.

But......my only nagging concern in my head is using the Raptor in fairly thick conditions. Our mutual friend in South Carolina I believe has mentioned it too that if the bullet hits anything of substance prior to hitting the animal, things go badly with the Raptor. Would you still used it in thick conditions where the chance of hitting brush just in front of a buff is highly likely?

This is the one and only concern I still hold onto in regards to the CEBs.

 

[PaulT]

Phil, your concerns are well founded, but not specific to the Raptors.

My buffalo concession was located in a specific region of Arnhemland that dictated thick brush conditions, especially so in the early part of the season.

As far as I am concerned, and remember this is only MY opinion, there is no such thing as a "brush-bucking" projectile.
You can imagine that in 12 years of guiding hunters from all over the World I got to see a great many combinations of calibers and projectiles.
IF there are any variables that MAY be applied it seems to me that the heavier AND slower the projectile the LESS it is effected BUT where those parameters lay is anyone's guess.

I personally hold the view that for the first shot no-one should take that shot until the target is clear and a vital zone is achievable.
Don't start something you can't finish.

After the first shot has landed it's all in.
We have a responsibility to stop a wounded animal and I would NOT hold back regardless of the surrounds, if and when a good shot presents.

I have punched Raptors through tall grass, tree leaves and small saplings and in every case hit the target BUT i'm NOT by any means suggesting Raptors "buck" the brush.
I don't believe they do, nor do I believe that there is a bullet out there currently on the market that is not to some/any/all extent effected by the influence of impact with brush.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

Phil, your concerns are well founded, but not specific to the Raptors.

My buffalo concession was located in a specific region of Arnhemland that dictated thick brush conditions, especially so in the early part of the season.

As far as I am concerned, and remember this is only MY opinion, there is no such thing as a "brush-bucking" projectile.
You can imagine that in 12 years of guiding hunters from all over the World I got to see a great many combinations of calibers and projectiles.
IF there are any variables that MAY be applied it seems to me that the heavier AND slower the projectile the LESS it is effected BUT where those parameters lay is anyone's guess.

I personally hold the view that for the first shot no-one should take that shot until the target is clear and a vital zone is achievable.
Don't start something you can't finish.

After the first shot has landed it's all in.
We have a responsibility to stop a wounded animal and I would NOT hold back regardless of the surrounds, if and when a good shot presents.

I have punched Raptors through tall grass, tree leaves and small saplings and in every case hit the target BUT i'm NOT by any means suggesting Raptors "buck" the brush.
I don't believe they do, nor do I believe that there is a bullet out there currently on the market that is not to some/any/all extent effected by the influence of impact with brush.

Fair enough Paul, good conversation as always! Hope all is well with you and Mrs. T!!

 

[PaulT]

Fair enough Paul, good conversation as always! Hope all is well with you and Mrs. T!!

G'day Phil.

Please remember that what I have posted is simply a reflection of my opinion based on my observations and not meant as a mandate to what anyone else believes or does.

Each unto their own.

Mrs T and I are doing well, life is back on track and we are happy and healthy (relatively for people OUR age !!!!).
We have two new Pups (GWP's) who keep us fit and very busy.
I now eagerly await the approach of the end of Autumn when the heat burns off and the threat of snakes dissipates and I can get my oldest, Penny, back out in the bush trailing Sambar Deer.

Maybe not Buffalo but still entertaining and rewarding hunting taking deer with a dog and certainly keeps the fridge full of meat that is a lot more palatable than buff !!!!!!

Miss your company, hope to make the trek back to Dallas some day in the future to catch up over and adult beverage

My best to you and your young family

 

[BobT]

Thanks for the replies gentlemen! I'm going to give the solids a try in the near future, hopefully I can find few pigs to try them on before heading to Tanzania in August.

Phil and Royal, it was great to finally meet you both at the dinner !

 

[Rule 303]

PaulT the only projectile I have found that tracks true after hitting/penetrating bush, trees ect is the Woodleigh Hydro. Now this is only my experience and some experimentation results. I trust them but I do realise that there is always an exception to the rule and wider experience may have encountered different conditions that lead to a different result.
Good information about the raptors.

 

[PaulT]

G'day Rule.

I've not used the Hydros myself but did have hunters that were using them.
They certainly do penetrate deep, and straight too, there's no denying that, and I also like the way they leave a clean cut open entry hole, much like the CEB's.

I THINK that most flat meplat bullets will be less effected by impact with obstructions but again I believe that the best remedy is to avoid doing so until it is absolutely necessary, regardless of bullet being used.

Just my thoughts.

 

[Rule 303]

G'day Rule.

I've not used the Hydros myself but did have hunters that were using them.
They certainly do penetrate deep, and straight too, there's no denying that, and I also like the way they leave a clean cut open entry hole, much like the CEB's.

I THINK that most flat meplat bullets will be less effected by impact with obstructions but again I believe that the best remedy is to avoid doing so until it is absolutely necessary, regardless of bullet being used.

Just my thoughts.

Paul I do agree with you. No sense pushing the odds if you do not have to.