Classic Double rifles with exposed hammers

[Altitude sickness]

I am selling my Pedersoli double 9.3 in the classifieds and have received questions and comments on the hammers. And that it has no safety.
So I don’t spread false information. I thought I would ask here. Knowing the wealth of knowledge with the old classic doubles with hammers.

So, correct me if I’m wrong. On my rifle the hammer springs are still new and strong so accidentally setting them would be difficult.

Both or one can be cocked at a time with the thumb

IMO the hammers make the equivalent of large cocking indicators for a PH or hunting partners.

The hammers do not rest on the firing pins. So can not be struck from behind causing an AD

So please ad any pros and cons of a modern rifle being made with exposed hammers and no safety. So I am relaying accurate info to perspective buyers. Thank you in advance.

 

[CarsonG]

Absolutely gorgeous.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

I've hunted pheasants with exposed hammer Parker shotguns. To do so safely but also be ready to fire, one carries the gun with the action slightly open. When the dog points, or a flushing dog is one the bird, the action is closed while shouldering the gun. A PH telling a client to get ready to shoot woudl be no different.

While not as fast as making a shot with modern hammerless (internal hammers) gun with a tang mounted safety, the above process may be as fast as shooting with a external cocking tang rifle such as my Krieghoff Classic.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Mark, as a kid that’s how I hunted birds also. Albeit with a cheap single shot 20 gauge. Exposed hammer, no safety. As the gun came up the hammer was coming back.

When I made the big time and could afford a double shotgun. (A Fox was fancy for me in those days) . I got handy at pulling both hammers with one motion.

Without the index finger in the trigger guard :>)))

 

[AZDAVE]

On the original doubles most had a half cocked notch. and the High grade doubles had a stalking safety that engaged. One required you to just cock the hammers and shoot. The high grade required you to pull the stalking safety back then cock the hammers. A small difference in the manual of arms for each.

On your pedersoli it is like the first cock and shoot.

The biggest safety on any firearm or mechanical device is the space between the ears of the operator. It boils down to the responsibility of said operator and assuming responsibility for ones actions.

When I hunt with my 12 bore underhammer muzzle loader I carry it on half cock, that said I only hunt with a couple guys that are as safety conscious as me with good muzzle discipline. That being said I also tested all my hammer doubles and muzzle loaders with a 4ft drop test straight down onto the butt 10 times before I will carry them in a half cocked condition. I have owned 4 hammer doubles and all 4 passed this test. I had a reproduction sharps that didn't. a little work on the half cock notch.

If your pedersoli was mine I would go out in the yard put two dummy rounds in the chambers, find a nice grassy little mound, hold the rifle by the action and drop it straight on the butt. I would also test it in the fully cocked state. Now this test isn't for the faint of heart. as if you have any unseen cracks in the stock they will let you know.

In our current litigation societies the lawyers have capitalized on the current belief by many of the woke fraternity is that life should be perfectly safe, and any thing that isn't should be sued.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

My life’s first shotgun was a single barrel barreled Pakistani 12 gauge (2.75”) hammer Sikender brand shotgun with a 32” fully choked barrel.

In order to carry it safely, I used to carry it with the breech slightly open (similar to @Mark A Ouellette ’s strategy) and would simply shut it while snapping the shotgun up to my shoulder while simultaneously cocking the hammer. With a little practice, it became like second nature to me.

A forest ranger by the name of Jabbar Molla (an avid hunter himself) used to work for me, whom I had assigned to head an anti tiger poaching patrol unit during the 1980s. He was (and still is) an exceptionally good shot with exposed hammer shotguns (his one is a Midland Gun Company exposed hammer Demon Duck shotgun in 12 gauge 3” Magnum with 32” fully choked barrels).

He used to tell me “Sir, a firearm is only as safe as the operator is cautious”

 

[Altitude sickness]

Thank you for the knowledge sharing gentleman.

 

[pilar]

Having exposed hammers wouldn’t bother me one bit!
I have exposed hammer single shot rifles and shotgun and have never had a problem

 

[rookhawk]

I am selling my Pedersoli double 9.3 in the classifieds and have received questions and comments on the hammers. And that it has no safety.
So I don’t spread false information. I thought I would ask here. Knowing the wealth of knowledge with the old classic doubles with hammers.

So, correct me if I’m wrong. On my rifle the hammer springs are still new and strong so accidentally setting them would be difficult.

Both or one can be cocked at a time with the thumb

IMO the hammers make the equivalent of large cocking indicators for a PH or hunting partners.

The hammers do not rest on the firing pins. So can not be struck from behind causing an AD

So please ad any pros and cons of a modern rifle being made with exposed hammers and no safety. So I am relaying accurate info to perspective buyers. Thank you in advance. View attachment 560187View attachment 560188

Rebounding hammers stand little chance of an accidental discharge of the rifle when they are parked. (uncocked)

The danger comes in with double rifles and hammer shotguns when someone is on approach and they cock the gun while still stalking. That is completely unsafe since there is no safety and the firearm could go off if a finger brushes the triggers, or if a stick were to bump them.

The reason that hammer guns are still popular in wingshooting is that they can be used for continental driven hunts, where you are immobile, at your peg, and you are cocking the hammers as you are firing the gun for high pheasants.

The better Victorian and Edwardian hammer double rifles of English make that are occasionally still used for dangerous game are not ideal, but they all will have stalking safeties which are an inconvenient way to block the hammers from falling until they are slid forward...two safeties for two hammers inconveniently located on the sides of the hammer sidelock plates.

If you want to feel the tradition of using a 1910 era Rigby 470NE with a jones rotary under lever and exposed hammers with stalking safeties, by all means enjoy the anachronism. But it is inconvenient when used safely, and it is wholly unsafe in the manner most hunters intend to use them for hunting. (cocked without safety on final approach)

 

[pilar]

Rebounding hammers stand little chance of an accidental discharge of the rifle when they are parked. (uncocked)

The danger comes in with double rifles and hammer shotguns when someone is on approach and they cock the gun while still stalking. That is completely unsafe since there is no safety and the firearm could go off if a finger brushes the triggers, or if a stick were to bump them.

The reason that hammer guns are still popular in wingshooting is that they can be used for continental driven hunts, where you are immobile, at your peg, and you are cocking the hammers as you are firing the gun for high pheasants.

The better Victorian and Edwardian hammer double rifles of English make that are occasionally still used for dangerous game are not ideal, but they all will have stalking safeties which are an inconvenient way to block the hammers from falling until they are slid forward...two safeties for two hammers inconveniently located on the sides of the hammer sidelock plates.

If you want to feel the tradition of using a 1910 era Rigby 470NE with a jones rotary under lever and exposed hammers with stalking safeties, by all means enjoy the anachronism. But it is inconvenient when used safely, and it is wholly unsafe in the manner most hunters intend to use them for hunting. (cocked without safety on final approach)

I’m sure some nimrod would be unsafe with a hammer rifle, the people I hunt with are very proficient with all sorts of hammer guns, muzzle loader, shotgun, heavy weapons
I have never seen them handle a weapon cocked till final approach, even on dangerous game a weapon isn’t cocked or off safety till it’s game time, and only after the first shot
should a heavy weapon be cocked for a second shot much like chambering a round in a bolt gun only faster
so I agree with you , yet disagree

 

[AES]

Carrying it chambered but uncocked is a perfect proxy for a safety … like an R8 but you see that it’s uncocked. I’ve never had an experience where I need a first shot at a piece of game, in less time than it takes to pull the hammers (should take little to no more time than shouldering the rifle).

 

[Altitude sickness]

I agree, I don’t think you should be walking on final stalk with a hammer cocked or a traditional safety off.
I don’t cock the hammer, or throw the safety off until my muzzle is pointed and I’m ready to shoot.

 

[SFRanger7GP]

For the past 15+ years, my primary shotgun is an 1883 Charles Lancaster side lever hammer gun. Like any system, you must practice to be safe and proficient. I have used it for pass shooting, tower shoots, rough shoots and birds with dogs. I hang in there with the best of them. No shotgun has ever felt more special to me than a hammer gun.

You have a beautiful, classic style rifle that someone will greatly enjoy if he/she is willing to put in the time to be safe and proficient with it. Anyone with safety concerns needs to question themselves, not the firearms system. GLWS

Safe shooting

 

[93marlin]

Currently I am privileged enough to own 3 antique hammer guns. 2double rifles and one 12 gauge shotgun. I've used one of the rifles to take 3 black bear.
Be cautious and be very familiar with your rifle.
Hammer guns have been working at their intended purpose for a long time. They do the job and most absolutely beautifully made.