Sporting Clays - Caesar Guerini Summit Sporting

[HankBuck]

Wanted some opinions on the Caesar Guerini “Summit Sporting” from either casual Clays shooters or competitors.
I’ve been shooting Browning 425 & older 325 models for 20 years also a few hunting Citori’s and very pleased with them all, they can handle 1000’s of rounds (my 20ga has 50,000-70,000 rds and only replaced ejector). My 425 12ga, 30” barrels has been my Go To lately and has about 40,000+ rds thru it —- it shoots fine and fits me well. I shoot Sporting Clays mostly and enjoy tournaments (but I’m No threat to win any).
I don’t see many Caesars out in Competitions compared to numerous Browning 725s, Beretta’s, or even Kreigoff‘s.…but Caesar is a much smaller manufacturer and have only been around for 20 years. Their Customer Service is highly rated (Browning CS is the worst I’ve ever experienced and Beretta might be 2nd). My main reasons for Caesar is 1). I WANT one. 2). They have a nice “look” to them, very good wood even in standard versions and appeal to my taste. 3). Above average “trigger” and consistently mentioned as better then other shotguns in this price range (my Brownings are All adequate but ‘Sloppy’. 4). Reasonable price ($5000) for good level of quality and true Left Hand Stocks with proper Cast. While I’m interested in all opinions that have experience with any Brands in this price range ($5000-$7000) I’m mostly wanting to hear from current Guerini owners & competitive shooters - especially those that have used other brands and switched to Caesar “or” used Caesar and then Switched back to another brand. Warning: I’m already “rolling down hill” on the Caesar and might be hard to stop me —- I’m close to “emotional” about this and might need a good SLAP !!

 

[jrnicho]

I've had a summit limited since they were introduced with 34" barrels (and have another set of 30"). When I was shooting competitively (more than a decade ago) this was my primary gun and even used it to feed my box bird addiction (hence the set of 30" barrels). 10s of thousands of rounds have gone down the barrels including a steady supply of 1 1/4 pigeon loads. So far I have had no issues, nor has it been in for service (other than having the 30" barrels fitted).
JRN

 

[WAB]

They make a fine weapon. I would say that they are better known for their dynamic game guns than their competition guns.

There were some quality issues when they first hit the US market. In fact, I was standing right behind a close friend when his barrel failed rather spectacularly during an informal round of skeet. They were very closed mouthed about it, but I believe that there were mono block issues. I believe that this was totally resolved many years ago but it’s hard to forget.

 

[HankBuck]

I've had a summit limited since they were introduced with 34" barrels (and have another set of 30"). When I was shooting competitively (more than a decade ago) this was my primary gun and even used it to feed my box bird addiction (hence the set of 30" barrels). 10s of thousands of rounds have gone down the barrels including a steady supply of 1 1/4 pigeon loads. So far I have had no issues, nor has it been in for service (other than having the 30" barrels fitted).
JRN

jmicho: it’s rare for me to see 34” barrels anymore on a Sporting Clays range - although some might escape my notice, by far 32” is the common length for top competitors & the “common Man” followed by 30”. Would you be able to do-it-all with 32”? I considered getting a 20ga in 30” just because I might occasionally use it for hunting (12ga would be 32”) and also I’ve never used any barrel longer then 30” —- I seem to shoot an older Browning 325 with 28” as well as my 425 /30”….but then I’m far from “Master Class”. I believe most is personal preference and what’s “in fashion”. In the 1980s & early 90s barrels of 26” were the rage for American skeet and now 28”& 30” seems to dominate. Europe always tended towards longer barrels for Sporting Clays but even there 32” is much more common then 34”. If I could pick up 5 birds a round — I’d shoot 36” !! But that’s unlikely so I’m gonna try the 32” on whatever I get….My misses are “always Me” regardless of barrel length.

 

[Philip Glass]

I have the Summit Sporting and my oldest son has the trap model. They are very nice guns and we have no complaints.

 

[Andrew Short]

I can’t comment on the Summit but I donhave The Magnus in 20 gauge. It’s my primary quail fun. As Philip said, they are nice guns and I have zero complaints.

Perhaps @BeeMaa can share his opinion.

 

[BeeMaa]

I can’t comment on the Summit but I donhave The Magnus in 20 gauge. It’s my primary quail fun. As Philip said, they are nice guns and I have zero complaints.

Perhaps @BeeMaa can share his opinion.

I’ve held several of them, but never shot one. I was considering one of these (can’t remember which one) when I was at Cove Creek but chose the Blaser F3 Vantage instead.

I appreciate your confidence in my knowledge, but I’m not much of an authority on “fine” shotguns for lack of experience shooting them. I’ve handled them, but that hardly qualifies as any type of practical experience. YouTube would be a better source of information than me.

Now then, if you want to talk about what shell you are using, at what distance and what game…I’m your man.

 

[HankBuck]

I’ve held several of them, but never shot one. I was considering one of these (can’t remember which one) when I was at Cove Creek but chose the Blaser F3 Vantage instead.

I appreciate your confidence in my knowledge, but I’m not much of an authority on “fine” shotguns for lack of experience shooting them. I’ve handled them, but that hardly qualifies as any type of practical experience. YouTube would be a better source of information than me.

Now then, if you want to talk about what shell you are using, at what distance and what game…I’m your man.

BeeMaa: If I get a Caesar and shoot it well - likely Not going to pattern or choke test it…BUT, if I start missing and need a “diagnostic expert” on pattern & choke — YOU will be my go to Expert. Briley & Carlson pale in comparison to your experience

 

[BeeMaa]

BeeMaa: If I get a Caesar and shoot it well - likely Not going to pattern or choke test it…BUT, if I start missing and need a “diagnostic expert” on pattern & choke — YOU will be my go to Expert. Briley & Carlson pale in comparison to your experience

Appreciate it, but that’s hardly the case. Happy to help any way I can. Cheers.

 

[RLL]

Second hand here, but 2 guys I know that do shoot them competitively loved them. The only issue I’ve seen on several was aesthetic and the action screws were not in line. Minor, but for the money I’d expect them to be straight.

 

[HankBuck]

Second hand here, but 2 guys I know that do shoot them competitively loved them. The only issue I’ve seen on several was aesthetic and the action screws were not in line. Minor, but for the money I’d expect them to be straight.

RLL, agree, I would expect proper function and correct assembly out of any New firearm regardless of price. Caesar Guerini Summit Sporting, at approximately $5000, would be on the lower end price range for a competitive Sporting Clays gun - but since I’m Not a Top level competitor (and Not rich) - it’s good enough for me. My Son, Daughter InLaw and one friend all have one and none of us are “sponsored“ shooters - and likely to remain that way. Mechanically I think the Summit Sporting is solid but there are better and more solid builds from some Beretta’s - like their DT11 model and of course Perazzi & Kreigoff - they also cost 3x to 4x as much. Aesthetically I think the Caesar Summit is much nicer looking (to my taste) than other guns in it’s price range and especially their quality wood, checkering, finish etc.. Hopefully I can shoot it well enough to “deserve it”.

 

[Stompbox]

I’ve owned CG shotguns since they came out, have or had Summit Sporting models in 12, 20 & 28 gauge. I had a lot of issues with my first 20 gauge, it went back 4 or 5 times until they got the problem corrected, no issues with any of them in a very long time now. I own a few Browning 425 models and switch back and forth between the Browning and CG without any problem, they fit very similar to me. The CG Shotguns are very solid, reliable guns and I wouldn’t hesitate to use one. About a year and a half ago I started shooting a K80 and have used that primarily, it’s taken me a while to get used to how it fits and functions, but I’d never shy away from using a Caesar Guerini.

 

[HankBuck]

I’ve owned CG shotguns since they came out, have or had Summit Sporting models in 12, 20 & 28 gauge. I had a lot of issues with my first 20 gauge, it went back 4 or 5 times until they got the problem corrected, no issues with any of them in a very long time now. I own a few Browning 425 models and switch back and forth between the Browning and CG without any problem, they fit very similar to me. The CG Shotguns are very solid, reliable guns and I wouldn’t hesitate to use one. About a year and a half ago I started shooting a K80 and have used that primarily, it’s taken me a while to get used to how it fits and functions, but I’d never shy away from using a Caesar Guerini.

Stomp box: Interesting that you find the Caesar Summit & Browning 425 fit/feel similar - that would help me if I switch back & forth between the two - as I currently own, shoot, and like my 425. I’ve only shot a few rounds with a Caesar Summit and it was my Friends 12ga limited — that field slightly lighter and “slimmer” but after only 4-6 shots it was certainly Not enough to get a comparison. Also, as a Lefty, his Guns slight Cast Off probebly didn’t give me the best fit/eye alignment but I could really notice either way. I’m hoping that the Caesar has are noticeable “Lefty Cast” —- my 425 is a LH version (Sold only by Miller’s in Delaware) but besides the LH palm swell — I don’t think the actual cast is as much as the Caesar. I have read that some of earlier Caesar’s had some barrel regulation issues (which Caesar would fix-free) but have Not read of any recent mechanical issue….there were some cosmetic issues with the “Limited case hardening “flaking” but that seems to have also been improved in the past 2 years. I just had my 425 “jam” during recent Clays Shoot and local GS repaired “gunked up, dirty barrel selector switch”….first issue in 20 years and 25,000+ rounds. Will test it out again this weekend and hope it’s good to go.

 

[wayne schiavi]

I have had a sumit trap combo 34 top single 32over under they work perfect. The service is second to non I had the momo block break after 11000 rounds at a major tournament. I called them they had me send it in they replaced the barrel at no charge and ha it back in six days.the

 

[HankBuck]

I have had a sumit trap combo 34 top single 32over under they work perfect. The service is second to non I had the momo block break after 11000 rounds at a major tournament. I called them they had me send it in they replaced the barrel at no charge and ha it back in six days.the

Wayne, I’ve heard and read much about Caesar”s reputation for great service - 2nd to none and far superior to Browning/Beretta. That is a factor in my decision but a minor one - i want an exceptional value for a Competitive Sporting Clays gun….I “think” Caesar is that —- in the $5000 to $8000 range

 

[WAB]

I have had a sumit trap combo 34 top single 32over under they work perfect. The service is second to non I had the momo block break after 11000 rounds at a major tournament. I called them they had me send it in they replaced the barrel at no charge and ha it back in six days.the

Interesting that you had a mono block issue. As reported earlier, I was witness to a catastrophic failure on one of their early guns that originated at the mono block/barrel juncture. There were a number of mono block issues early on. It was my understanding that these had been completely resolved. Is yours an early gun?


By comparison, I shot a UK sourced Miroku 9000 in competition for many years. These are special guns, lightweight proofed barrels with 2 3/4” chambers making for a very dynamic weapon. I had this gun stripped down by the AK Kriefhoff smith after what we can best guess was 150,000 rounds. It was immaculate. In his words ‘if Kriegoff’s were this reliable I’d be out of a job’!

 

[HankBuck]

Interesting that you had a mono block issue. As reported earlier, I was witness to a catastrophic failure on one of their early guns that originated at the mono block/barrel juncture. There were a number of mono block issues early on. It was my understanding that these had been completely resolved. Is yours an early gun?


By comparison, I shot a UK sourced Miroku 9000 in competition for many years. These are special guns, lightweight proofed barrels with 2 3/4” chambers making for a very dynamic weapon. I had this gun stripped down by the AK Kriefhoff smith after what we can best guess was 150,000 rounds. It was immaculate. In his words ‘if Kriegoff’s were this reliable I’d be out of a job’!

WAB: I assume your UK Miroku (Browning) was fixed choke barrels and Not the choke tubes? - I’ve read they are sold in Europe and that the very few top competitors that use Browning prefer the fixed choke barrels. Some comment; “don’t want to think about changing chokes” and also “better patterns”….since top shooters rarely change chokes and tend towards Mod or tighter - made sense.

 

[chashardy]

I came close to getting a Caesar Guerini, but ended up staying with Beretta. In the price range you are looking at, you should consider the Beretta 694. They offer it in several clay gun options and barrel lengths and it has been very well reviewed by lots of folks on youtube. I will admit that the Summit is a prettier shotgun than a 694. (I shoot a DT11 and have had no issues after 5000+ rounds over the last couple of years. Heading to Elm Fork to shoot some clays now.)

 

[HankBuck]

I came close to getting a Caesar Guerini, but ended up staying with Beretta. In the price range you are looking at, you should consider the Beretta 694. They offer it in several clay gun options and barrel lengths and it has been very well reviewed by lots of folks on youtube. I will admit that the Summit is a prettier shotgun than a 694. (I shoot a DT11 and have had no issues after 5000+ rounds over the last couple of years. Heading to Elm Fork to shoot some clays now.)

Chashardy: Nothing wrong with Beretta’s and I would (and did) consider their DT11 but it’s out of my current price range and above what I “deserve” based on my skill level….maybe when I’m consistently in “A” Class. I’m familiar with the 694 and it’s not what I’m interested in - no clear advantage over the Caesar in any area and certainly worse service if needed (and it’s Not the pretty girl at the Prom)

 

[WAB]

WAB: I assume your UK Miroku (Browning) was fixed choke barrels and Not the choke tubes? - I’ve read they are sold in Europe and that the very few top competitors that use Browning prefer the fixed choke barrels. Some comment; “don’t want to think about changing chokes” and also “better patterns”….since top shooters rarely change chokes and tend towards Mod or tighter - made sense.

It does have choke tubes but the much lighter weight barrels (thinner walls) that 2 3/4” proof allows. You are right on changing chokes. I shot at a very high level and never did it, a total waste of time IMO. I believe it was Gary Phillips who won the World’s without changing a tube. The first time you shoot midi’s off the 130’ deck at Holland and Holland with an IC or 1/4 choke you will realize how effective modern loads are at distance. I no longer compete for a number of reasons, one of which is the ridiculous rule change allowing a high gun. Mounting a shotgun is integral to shooting a shotgun. It is mind boggling to me why we insist on dumbing down clay target games in this country.