Sticky situation with outfitter - advice appreciated

[Fredrik]

Hi all!

I´ve ended up in a sticky situation and would gladly receive some advice. I´ll keep all identifiable info out not to discredit this outfitter prematurely.

I do believe some background is necessary. I have a lower income level than many on this forum and in 2014 I decided that I wanted to hunt a certain prime animal in Africa. I´ve made many tough sacrifices along the way and saved hard. My initial plan was to go in 2024, but I have been saving enough to go already in 2022.

Having worked for this for years I had a good idea of what I wanted and I found an offer from a smaller outfitter where the owner, let´s call him Bob, is also the PH. One client at a time in camp, just what I want. I checked him up online, contacted everyone I could find on any forum that had hunted with him and not a single negative word from anyone, rather the opposite, only words of praise and recommendations to go with this guy. So, in Jan 2020 I signed the deal. In the deal for this prime animal, there was also a possibility to add on a specific animal at a special price, let´s call it a springbuck (which it of course isn´t). I confirmed that I´d like to take up the offer on the "springbuck" long before this season kicked in. Hunt is taking place in a few months in South Africa (not mentioning the province). The price for the springbuck deal is in the contract, and the "springbuck" is a number 2 on my bucket list and hence an important part of why I signed the deal originally.

It´s now getting closer to the hunt date and I got an email that the prices of "springbucks" have gone up, and unfortunately the price would now be 75% higher than the price in the contract. I questioned this and got a response that it can still be taken for the original price, but that requires a 2hr hike each direction to a distant area where he owns his own "springbucks". This would mean that a significant part of the hunt would be spent in transportation, albeit on foot (also one of the reasons for choosing this outfit was that all concessions were reachable within max 30 min driving, with the main intended one in 15 min). Another consequence is that unless I pay the higher trophy fee, I´ll NOT be able to take a "springbuck" if we stumble upon one while hunting the prime animal. Considering my budget I don´t have a lot o spare days so this could significantly reduce my odds on the "springbuck".

From a true legal aspect I do believe that I have a strong position, but that´s not all in this case. Me and Bob are supposed to hunt together and spend a lot of time in the bush. If I come there and we have differences already from the start, I´m quite convinced that this experience that I´ve dreamt of and worked hard for, for 8 years won´t be what I expected. On the other hand, the beans are already spilled and the trust Bob has gained from me (which was quite substantially) has already taken a significant dent.

Any advice on how to act are highly appreciated.

 

[Phil Giordano]

Hello Fredrik - well, I perfectly understand you. The problem with an outfitter that is also the guide, is that you'll hunt and spend a lot of time with him, and the goal is to have good time during your hunt.
Difficult give you a solution. Do you have the perception that him is actually doing the very best to make you happy with the hunt, despite the program change, or the opposite? It's quite simple. If you feel that you're not at home with his program/decision, be very clear with him and let him know. Be kind but be very clear. Better now than later on during the hunt...

 

[375Fox]

Without knowing specifics and pricing, all I can say is if you don’t trust your outfitter/PH you won’t enjoy your hunt. Also, if outfitter quoted too low he may not enjoy the hunt either. It sounds like it might not be a good deal for either of you.

 

[WAB]

If it were me I would spell out my concerns directly with ‘Bob’. It sounds like he is hunting on someone else’s land and is being forced to pass on a price increase for the ‘springbok’. However, you have a contract which puts him in a bind.

You may find that he is such a small outfit that he can’t afford to eat the price increase himself.

In any case, you need to clear the air or cancel the hunt. This is supposed to be fun!

 

[Gemsbok45]

If you look at a lots of these contracts,prices can change without notice. I don’t believe a guy with a great rep just plonks down a 75 percent increase.You still have your main trophy to pursue. Whether it’s Kudu,Gemsbok,Springbok or Bushbuck,you will have the time of your life. Don’t fool yourself into thinking this is your only trip!!!

 

[DieJager]

Is it the money that's bothering you, or because a deal is a deal? Because if it's the money. If your budget is that tight, I am wondering if you could fully enjoy your hunt.
Because it is probably a couple of hundred bucks, do not let your hunt get spoiled for that amount of money

Edit: I see springbok is not the animal you talking about. So maybe it is quite more, the money, and then it becomes a big deal

 

[Newboomer]

Is it the money that's bothering you, or because a deal is a deal? Because if it's the money. If your budget is that tight, I am wondering if you could fully enjoy your hunt.
Because it is probably a couple of hundred bucks, do not let your hunt get spoiled for that amount of money

Edit: I see springbok is not the animal you talking about. So maybe it is quite more, the money, and then it becomes a big deal

To me,as a former businessman, a contract is a binding document. I've had to eat price increases at times. Sometimes you can renegotiate a contract and everyone wins. Talk to your PH and see what you can arrange or rearrange. You may have to settle for another species rather than the "springbok", your second choice. Maybe your third choice this time and pick up your second choice next time and believe me, if you go to Africa once, you will return.

 

[Berettaco]

I agree with @WAB - call the PH and discuss your concerns. I’ve ran into similiar situations, I would guess the landowners are raising prices - plus the fuel cost increases, not sure about the 75% tho

 

[Aaron.F]

To me it depends on what animal we are talking About. If the trophy fee is let’s say, $300 and it goes up 75%, I would still probably do it. If the trophy fee is $2000, I would not. I also agree from a legal perspective you are in the right, however in the greater scheme of things this may not matter. It is more about the experience and your experience may be getting soured.

 

[375Fox]

I wouldn’t call a hunting contract signed 2.5 years before a hunt a solid contract. Beyond the year it’s signed, I’d only call it a sign of good faith on both parties. I’ve never seen a contract without the clause “prices subject to change without notice”. If it is booked and changes the year the hunt is booked, that’s bad business. A price increase 2.5 years later though isn’t surprising, however a 75% increase is.

 

[Ryan]

Things definitely need to get aired out or both sides have a good chance of walking away less than pleased. Sounds like neither side is working with much room for error.

I understand not wanting to bring up the outfitter by name but the secondary animal makes less sense to me and makes answering this tougher. I'm going to take a guess and say it's a higher priced animal such as a sable, which can have a wide difference in cost. In that case 75% would be possible and significant. An area you can only walk to seems odd, especially if it's a piece of land he owns and hunts. Assuming you take the walk how does he intend on getting that animal out once it's down? Just seems odd unless it's a tiny ten species. Need more information there.

As a comprimise what is his daily fees? If it's significantly cheaper than the 75% increase and you can cope with it financially and time wise I'd say take your buffalo in one area and the other animal in the other.

 

[sureshot375]

It’s really hard to give advice without knowing the specifics. It sounds like you bought a hunt for the “prime animal” where the outfitter is hunting someone else's land. It’s not uncommon then that you would be limited to hunting only the prime animal while on this other land.

In your 2020 writings did the outfitter specifically say you could hunt the prime animal and this other animal at the same time on the same property?

I’m having a hard time figuring what animal has gone up in price 75%.

Many of these contracts have language that allows for price increases.

Is this your first hunt in Africa?

 

[Areaonereal]

I wouldn’t call a hunting contract signed 2.5 years before a hunt a solid contract. Beyond the year it’s signed, I’d only call it a sign of good faith on both parties. I’ve never seen a contract without the clause “prices subject to change without notice”. If it is booked and changes the year the hunt is booked, that’s bad business. A price increase 2.5 years later though isn’t surprising, however a 75% increase is.

If you make An agreement with consideration at a specific price and during a specific time period. Then you have an enforceable contact

 

[375Fox]

If you make An agreement with consideration at a specific price and during a specific time period. Then you have an enforceable contact

I’ve never seen a contract not state trophy fees subject to change. I’d walk away before forcing an outfitter to follow through on contract pricing, especially considering how small deposits are compared to total hunt cost.

 

[Rickmt]

Talk to him. Tell him what you think. Maybe hunt the land where he owns Springbok

 

[YancyW]

A 2 hour hike wouldn't stop me from shooting a cull animal, much less a trophy I actually wanted.

 

[buckshot85]

Too many vague “facts” to even answer.
start stating actual information or delete this wreck.

 

[Ridge Runner]

I have been somewhat of a same predicament. Unfortunately I had already paid for the hunt and in country.

Not knowing who your owner/ph is makes it hard for anyone who has hunted with them before to weigh in on this.

IMO, If you haven't fully paid for your hunt, discuss your frustration with the outfitter and work out a mutual agreement. If a mutual agreement can't be reached you might want to reconsider going with this outfitter as this could become a festering, over shadowing situation that would make a difference between having an unforgettably good time to having an unfortunate unforgettable bad time.

Thus you may need to consider cancelling your hunt with this outfitter and finding another outfitter. Better to sacrifice a little money for cancelling your hunt than a lot of money for a bad, especially a first, experience.

It's Africa. Just a suggestion: Your choice of second animal could be changed to another less expensive animal and plan your next trip with your second animal of this hunt as your primary animal and add a second or third less expensive animal to your second hunt, especially if these animals are PG animals.

 

[Fredrik]

Wow, didn´t expect this much feedback. Thank you all for the support!

First of all I want to correct a typo from my side, the contract was signed in Jan 2021, nothing else, hence ~1,5 years before the hunt.

I realize it´s hard to support without details but as this topic is still ongoing I´ll limit identifiable info, but I assume identifying the "springbuck" as the true animal won´t make much of a difference. The "springbuck" is in reality a sable, and hence you all understand that the increase of 75% is not just a few hundred USD.

I totally agree to everyone that this topic has to be straightened out before I go, otherwise the experience won´t be a good one for at least one of us.

To answer some specific questions that has come up so far:

- I have gained trust in "Bob" until now and I think he has been fair and square. He has been open and not put any pressure on me at all in any way before and he has been very professional in all communication prior to this, hence I was really surprised. It´s hard to say if he is "doing his outmost" but he has revealed the price he has to pay for the Sable to the landowner (which I of course cannot confirm if its true or not). That price is about 50% up from the price of the sable in our contract. Hence he is revealing his markup - which I assume is part of being honest.

- The contract doesn´t specify that the primary animal and the sable to be hunted in the same area but I was under the impression that was the case based on previous emails, but it´s not spelled out specifically.

- I have enquired on how to recover the animal if we are a 2hr trek out but I haven´t got a reply to that yet.

- I am willing to work for solution as backing out is not that appealing since I´ve waited 8 years for this, and basically made all plans for this entire year based on this trip. I have also paid a larger-than-normal deposit, which was one of the conditions for this deal.

- With a smaller outfit I do understand that if the landowner has a steep and sudden price increase, it might be too much to just swallow the cost for him, hence I´m willing to work for a solution. I do have a financial "buffer" that I planned would be handy if we either take the 2 sought animals early or if we stumble upon something extraordinary along the way, but most of that buffer would be eaten if I just take this added cost.

- I´m not opposed to a 2hr trek, but essentially that would cut a net of 2,5-3 hrs of hunting compared to driving to other concessions. After all, I´m there to hunt, not to trek.

- What bothers me are mainly two things. I value honesty very very high, and I got that impression of him as well. We had a deal. We had a willing seller and a willing buyer. Now, on a side note in an email shortly before the hunt, - from my view - he alters the conditions without any pre-warning. The other thing is true financial, if I accept the higher price and a nice bushbuck steps out. I´ll probably not be able to afford it, which kind of defeats the purpose of my buffer.

- There is a clause on price changes in the contract but it is only related to exchange rate, and the exchange rate ZAR/USD was ~15 when we signed and it´s now ~15,5 so no major difference there. However I don´t live in the US and the rate of my currency vs USD has increased about 20%, so I´ll experience a price increase there anyhow (which of course should not impact the outfitter, that one´s on me).

 

[flatwater bill]

A lot of small owner/operators in RSA are hurting after the turmoil of the last two years. Hope you can work out a win-win compromise and still enjoy your hunt..................FWB