The 450/400´s....the vintage ones..

Pondoro

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I have not seen so many of them...but I do know that many of them were made on the same action size as 450/465/470´s and thus weighed up to 11 pounds wich is more than necessary in this caliber..

I have a 450/400 3 1/4 made 1906 that is made on a smaller lighter action...nice to carry and relatively light...recoil aka .375H&H..

But wich are most common...the ones made on the large actions or the lighter ones..?
 
An 11 lbs .450-400 is an unnecessary cumbersome beast. By the way, that is one of the advantages of the .450 NE over the .470, is the ability to fit it in a smaller frame as well.

My Gibbs .450-400 3&1/4” built on a Webley & Scott PHV1 action weighs just shy of 10 lbs. It is well balanced and recoil is very similar to a .375 H&H weighing 9 lbs.
 
I certainly haven't seen them all, but I'll venture to say that perhaps no more than about 10-15% of the vintage .450/400's of either ilk were made on the so-called smaller or scaled action made specifically for the .450/400 and other cartridges with the same case-head diameter. I've only seen two, one in .450/400 (3,25") (bearing the Army & Navy name but on a long-bar Webley action) and one in the 3" version. The latter was a stunner: Watson Bros on a small-frame screw-grip action, deep-relief Kell-engraved, spectacular wood, 24" barrels, ejectors, and all together a lovely package. From a distance, it looked more like a .303 than a .450/400. A friend shot a buffalo bull with it in the Zambezi Valley before selling it to another collector.

The problem, for lack of a better term, with the .450/400's is that many were so-called trade rifles, made for export to the colonies and not necessarily bespoke rifles for individual customers. Most of these were made on larger, .470-capable actions, and they were overweight. Many of the Jeffery's that I've seen, especially the Thomas Turner-made ones, followed this recipe. They certainly don't recoil very much, though.

Many others were made on smaller actions, and they are generally very fine rifles. Like Dewald mentioned, 10 pounds or thereabouts, good handling, and nice to shoot. A friend of mine here in Australia even owns a matched pair of .450/400's. Made for Lyon & Lyon on smaller screw-grip actions, they are, as he is fond of saying, the ultimate gentleman's accessory.
 
Most 450/400s are plain working rifles but occasionally you find a stunner . I have a Westley Richards side lock made for the Maharana of Udaipur in 1920 which is superb . 26 inch barrels . 10.5 lbs weight . A dream to shoot and accurate . It is a best gun in every respect .
 
Most 450/400s are plain working rifles but occasionally you find a stunner . I have a Westley Richards side lock made for the Maharana of Udaipur in 1920 which is superb . 26 inch barrels . 10.5 lbs weight . A dream to shoot and accurate . It is a best gun in every respect .
Pictures please!
 
This isn’t what your talking about?
 

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The provenance of DFH’s rifle certainly pushes the price up significantly.

There is another Charles Lancaster 450-400 3&1/4” boxlock, on a screw-grip action available in SA for $9000 or R170K. Rifle is in good condition, has Southgate ejectors and still has a fair amount of colour on the action. I considered making an offer on it this weekend, as it has been in the market for 4 months now. Problem is it weighs 11 lbs, and has 28” barrels. Just to much of a good thing. I can’t see how the 30 fps that you stand to gain from the inch longer barrels, makes up for the extra pound in weight.

To me the sweet spot remains 26” barrels and 10 lbs, given an once or two to either side.
 
The one in the middle is my 1906 Joseph Lang, 25" barrels and 10 pounds..moonsight..

Rifles1.jpg
 
Yes, Webley long bar..the barrels are actually 26"..
 
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Lovely rifle Dewald.. :)
 
Thank you Sir
 
Posted before. .450cal G. Gibbs. Webley P-HV action. According to the educated the best boxlock action ever made in those days.
DaHV6OPh.jpg
 
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This isn’t what your talking about?
I was lucky enough to handle and shoulder this very rifle. It fit me rather well until I saw the estimate
 
An 11 lbs .450-400 is an unnecessary cumbersome beast. By the way, that is one of the advantages of the .450 NE over the .470, is the ability to fit it in a smaller frame as well.

My Gibbs .450-400 3&1/4” built on a Webley & Scott PHV1 action weighs just shy of 10 lbs. It is well balanced and recoil is very similar to a .375 H&H weighing 9 lbs
My Gibbs 450 with 28" barrels also made with a Webly Screw Grip action I have 2 sets of ser#s 1 for Gibbs another on the barrels I believe from Webly
 

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