416WSM on Siamese Mauser & 416/348Ackley Improved on Martini

[Rule 303]

Bod, it was with freshly annealed cases and the one of rounds had been in the bottom of the mag for a bit of time while pig shooting. The projectile had worked their way forward and stuck in the lands when I unloaded. So I am thinking too much powder trying to achieve your velocities with ADI powder.

 

[rdog]

That is the way I have heard of people doing it. Me, being a bit ham-fisted would get a gunsmith/toolmaker/mech engineer to do it.

Gee, rule 303 reducing the expander ball dia is easy spin it in a cordless drill & use 400 grit & finish with 800 or 1000 they are hard but it easy to reduce dia by .001 to .002 inch .

 

[BlueFlyer]

Interesting. I bet one could simply clamp the ball in drill press chuck and take it down a thousandths with fine emery cloth?

That is basically the same way I would do it, but I would put it in the lathe. To take such small amounts of material off and maintian surface finish you cannot use a cutting tool. When I made up the pilots for my Gritter's rod, I turned them within a couple of thou, then hardened them. And got them to final diameter by just running 1000grit emery cloth between my fingers (WD40 lubrication).

 

[Rule 303]

Gee, rule 303 reducing the expander ball dia is easy spin it in a cordless drill & use 400 grit & finish with 800 or 1000 they are hard but it easy to reduce dia by .001 to .002 inch .

rdog you greatly over estimate my abilities. You could give me an A Bomb to play with and when it went Bang a rod with a flag with the word Bang on it would pop out

 

[BlueFlyer]

I have been busy, but not sure how productive. I have 1 Chapman safety and 3 rifles that need a safety conversion. I was thinking of making a CAD model of the Chapman and then having a few machined up on a NC machining centre.
Then the photos popped up on here with the LH 3 position conversion on a 450Rigby. It was not exactly clear in the photos but it appeared to be a more simple design than the Chapman.
For the last week I have been spending most nights working on a CAD model (and refreshing my CAD skills). Given that Mauser 98 parts are getting more difficult to source and Siamese Mauser parts are near impossible, I am much happier to develop the design on the screen than sacreficing real parts.

Top view in the FIRE position.

Top view in the SAFE position.

Top view SAFE & LOCKED

Rear view FIRE position

Rear view SAFE position

This is what the Safety lever looks like from the plan view.

And from below.

Any thoughts, comments or input as to what could be wrong with the design or possible improvements would be appreciated. You tend to get a bit of tunnel vision when working on the screen.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Excellent. Left hand? I like that better than lever on the right side. I have a left hand wing style 2-position scope relief safety on my Springfield 03A3. It's more convenient for right hand shooter because when on the gun ready to fire the thumb is wrapped over the wrist.

The Chapman modification seemed a bit complicated. I bought it for my Springfield but figured it was beyond my abilities/equipment. I'm still looking for a different safety for the Springfield. The Buhler style wing safety is fine with the scope attached but switching to iron sights the unprotected lever gets caught on stuff easily and disengaged. 3-position safety on the side of shroud is better location.

If you figure this out for your Siamese Mauser, I may have some business for you. Winchester Model 70 3-position bolt shroud threads onto Springfield bolt. To make it work, I need someone who can engineer and machine a new striker/firing pin. A few guys have done it but they're not sharing their pattern. Myers makes the safety and striker ... for $400! Interested?

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Something is not adding up with your CAD images. Unclear to me how the lever actually engages the striker. Are you sure it's 3-position?

 

[AZDAVE]

I have been super busy and never had time to read this thread so this morning I read it from start to finish. very impressed with your work and with the good comments that everyone has left and helped with. I learned a couple things that I will be able to use on my builds in the future. Like the way your stock came out. The red oil in my opinion helps greatly on all walnut stocks. The rust blueing is so well executed.

I make mine in a pint canning jar with equal amounts of good linseed oil and turpentine to full the jar 3/4 of the way to the top. and add 2 ounces (54ish grams) or powdered alkenet root powder. Shake it up and sit it in a window in the shop. Shake it up once a week for 6 months. Then filter it through a coffee filter into another jar. It is ready for use. I usually use 2-3 coats then switch to what ever oil finish I plan for it.

In reading all the thread it has me considering building another 416 express (350 REM necked up to 416).

 

[Rule 303]

I like the idea of the safety being operated with the shooting hand thumb. I was taught on the ole SMLE 303. The safety is put to safe using your trigger finger and taken off with your thumb, quicker into action. The POM's (Brits) put a lot of thought into their battle rifle.

 

[BlueFlyer]

If you figure this out for your Siamese Mauser, I may have some business for you. Winchester Model 70 3-position bolt shroud threads onto Springfield bolt. To make it work, I need someone who can engineer and machine a new striker/firing pin. A few guys have done it but they're not sharing their pattern. Myers makes the safety and striker ... for $400!

The Winchester 3 position safety is a far more robust design, as the cam is fully supported in the shroud. I have never seen a Springfield action in the flesh, and just looking at the schematic diagrams there is a fair bit of work. If it is as simple as machining a groove in the striker to engage the safety cam then it would not be too bad to work it out.

After working with the Siamese Mauser, it is definately a metric design. Dimensions and diameters are all based on fits for full mm nominal dimensions.

There is only 1 company in the US that makes a Winchester designed 3 position safety specifically to fit the Siamese Mauser. And they will not export, so that is why I have gone down this path, and the exchange rate does not help. Your $400 is more like AU$750.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

The Winchester 3 position safety is a far more robust design, as the cam is fully supported in the shroud. I have never seen a Springfield action in the flesh, and just looking at the schematic diagrams there is a fair bit of work. If it is as simple as machining a groove in the striker to engage the safety cam then it would not be too bad to work it out.

After working with the Siamese Mauser, it is definately a metric design. Dimensions and diameters are all based on fits for full mm nominal dimensions.

There is only 1 company in the US that makes a Winchester designed 3 position safety specifically to fit the Siamese Mauser. And they will not export, so that is why I have gone down this path, and the exchange rate does not help. Your $400 is more like AU$750.

Using Winchester Model 70 shroud/safety for my Springfield requires fabricating a new striker. Different length and sear width.

The $400 Springfield kit made by Myers is considerably more expensive than his Model 70 safety for 98 Mauser because it includes striker. Someone on the forum recently acquired one of his Mauser safeties for $200 which is what I paid for my Parkwest safety.

I know about the exchange rate. $400 US = ~$600 Canadian.

 

[BlueFlyer]

Something is not adding up with your CAD images. Unclear to me how the lever actually engages the striker. Are you sure it's 3-position?

The standard mauser safety has a shaft that goes forward and locks the bolt handle when in the lock position. It relies on a rotation to engage the locking feature. For the design below there is a cam feature which will engagae a spring loaded plunger to lock the bolt handle.
Fire position, spring plunger is not drawn but will dampen the safety movement at this point (red highlighted area). Cocking piece blocking pin is clear of the cocking piece in recess machined into the shroud.

Now the safety is moved to the safe position and the cam still has not engaged the bolt lock plunger. The cocking piece blocking pin is at TDC (top dead centre - automotive term) and the interferance you can see, means the cocking piece has been lifted off the sear. A shallow grove is also to be machined into the cocking piece to index the safety and hold it in that position.

To lock the bolt the safety needs to rotate further anticlockwise so the cam engages the bolt lock plunger. The cocking piece blocking pin slides across the face of the cocking piece until it contacts the shroud, which blocks an further rotation. As the blocking pin has moved beyond TDC the firing pin spring holds the safety in that position.

I hope this helps understand the function better, although my explanation could possibly be better. The weak point of this design is the bending force on the blocking pin. The interferances need to be tuned to minimise the activating forces, and I have added a boss onto the safety lever to better support the blocking pin, although aesthetically the boss is a challenge.

This photo of the 450Rigby appears to show a feature machined into the shroud to park the blocking pin in the fired position.

This photo (not that clear) appears to show the blocking pin moved over into the shroud when in the fire position.