475 Nitro Express - Experience

VertigoBE

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Hello esteemed members,

does anyone use, or has experience using the .475 Nitro Express in the field, especially on pachyderms. Or any experience/warnings/pittfalls on the reloading front?

This caliber is garnering interest for me as an inbetween 450NE - 500NE. But mainly because hammer double rifles can be found in it.

Thanks,

V.
 
I have a vintage british double rifle in .475 3 1/4 NE.. This is basically a .450NE case necked up to take a .483" 480 grain bullet.. I get 2158fps fra 23" barrels with modern Kynoch ammo..

I shot an elephant in Botswana with it.. All the .450 - 476NE cartridges are very much alike ballistically..
 
One thing worth mentioning is that the 475No.2 has two different bullet diameters.
.483” for the Eley and .488” for the Jeffery.
Other than that, which is significant, the cases are virtually the same although I don’t think a Jeffery cartridge will chamber in a rifle made for the other. Not 100% on that though.
The No.2s are massive though!
On the left next to a 450 3-1/4”
 

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So if I understand correctly, I would need to buy 450NE cases, and neck them up to fit in either .483 or .488" bullets ?
 
That would only be for the 475 straight.
The No.2 is a different animal as you can see above.
So there is a .475NE 3.25 "straight", which can be replicated with a 450NE necked up to fit a .483" bullet

Then there is a .475NE N°2 "Eley" using .483" bullets
and a .475NE N°2 "Jeffery" using .488" bullets.

So three possibilities total?
 
The .475 3.25 Straight is not very common. It was probably a Cogswell & Harrison developement. I have seen rifles by C & H, R.B.Rodda and Midland Gun Co. (mine). Greener also made double rifles in the caliber in the 1920´s..
 
Would you have any comparison cartridge for a 475 3.25 , for penetration? It has sufficient SD and weight to penetrate on any angle for an elephant brain shot? Or a back up shot from behind if they keep running?
 
.450NE is very similar..
 
So if I understand correctly, I would need to buy 450NE cases, and neck them up to fit in either .483 or .488" bullets ?

Yes. But you'd also need to find un-obtainable brass if you ever intended to hunt in Africa where you need correct headstamps. You'd also need to find a PH that will let you hunt with a hammergun, not all will.

You'll do a chamber cast and slug the bore to figure out what you'll need. You'll mail the chamber casting to CH4D in the States and within 2-3 years they'll make you the correct dies for your chamber and bore, provided you also have brass already so we can determine the neck thickness of the brass so the custom dies size correctly. You can then use your imagination on how to smuggle those custom dies from the USA to the EU.

You'd also need a miracle to find the supplies of the correctly supplied softs and solids Woodleigh (only woodleigh?) made last about 15-20 years ago. I saw two boxes of 50 that sold for $250-$300 a box.

Once you've exhausted the global supply of those scarce woodleigh bullets, turning over as many rocks on 6 continents as you can, you'll have yourself a really attractive wallhanger.

Also keep in mind, there is surely a guy out there with a $125,000 best grade 475 that can't find bullets either and he'll be much more likely to take the box of obscenely expensive bullets than you will if he sees them.

Never voluntarily buy an obscure Nitro cartridge rifle of mid-grade. If you're buying the finest known example, I get it, you spent 6-figures on the gun and therefore why not spend 5-grand and hundreds of hours of your time locating brass, bullets, and dies that are perfect. But for a hammer gun? For an affordable hammer gun? Sounds unpleasant at every turn.

Or, another option that is more pleasant?



Wallace Shawn Emerges As Frontrunner To ...
 
So three possibilities total?

Probably hundreds of possibilities total. Take all those parameters, then consider you're buying a rifle built 125 years ago. A little mercuric primer erosion of the chamber and then a cleanup. A little corrosive powder leading to throat erosion that gets cleaned up. Next thing you know, you cannot extract a full length case and you're lathe-turning your brass to some oddball size 1/8th or 1/4 inch shorter so you can avoid the bulge in the throat. Or you're buying the wrong brass intentionally (oversized) because someone cleaned up chamber corrosion and now the correct brass is undersized.

At your hourly rate, the time you'll invest in such a gun will make it the most expensive gun in Belgium by the time it is regulated.
 
Geez rookhawk, where’s your sense of adventure?!!

That said, the 450No.2 is a better choice if you have your heart set on the biggest 450 cartridge ever made.
There are a few 475s on the market here in the US and they are notoriously slow movers.
Being in Belgium, I’d think that you could source components at home - the Belgians seemed to have an affinity for the 475No.2. You encounter Belgian doubles so chambered more often than English I think.
 
There are pitfalls for sure..as always with old double rifles.. One always have to check them..bore and barrel condition..check for looseness..chambers..

Miracles do happen..I have a source for the correct Woodleigh bullets.. In Europe. The hardest part is correct brass, perhaps Kynoch (Kynamco) still have some, they have the right headstamp.. Nobody ever checked my ammo for correct headstamps in Africa..where does this happen..? .450 NE brass can be used..

Die-sets may be sourced in Germany, perhaps Triebel or others can make custom dies..

Much easier to buy a double rifle in .470 for sure..
 
Geez rookhawk, where’s your sense of adventure?!!

That said, the 450No.2 is a better choice if you have your heart set on the biggest 450 cartridge ever made.
There are a few 475s on the market here in the US and they are notoriously slow movers.
Being in Belgium, I’d think that you could source components at home - the Belgians seemed to have an affinity for the 475No.2. You encounter Belgian doubles so chambered more often than English I think.

I do love adventure and I do love pretty guns. The more British, the better. I've also been down these roads before and its not fun.

If someone had all the components, dies, brass, and a regulation load with a test target, I'd have a much more enthusiastic attitude towards an endeavor on a 475, 475 #2, #4, whatever.

Point of order: In the 1970s after Kynoch was bankrupt, best double rifles were selling in the back of Shotgun News with all their accessories and original case for $250-$750 dollars. Some were listed for years and years. All because ammo was not available.

Brass for obscure calibers is very scarce, since Covid custom order dies have been discontinued by most makers, the others are big back orders. Then we fall prey to Woodleigh's unfortunate fire that means their odd bullets aren't available and they are prioritizing common calibers with pre-sold orders before they attempt any of the obscure options.

I have a friend on this forum that just got a 450-400 3.25" NE. That's probably in the top-5 most common NE cartridges of all time. (Pity it wasn't in the top-3 or he'd have easy access) He's struggling to find brass and I think he mailed away to Australia for a set of dies that were dusty on a shelf. Multiply the challenges many fold for a less known NE caliber and its a trail of tears.
 
Henry Krank in England has correct brass..

 
Rookhawk, did your friend get the 3-1/4” Manton that Cabelas had?
Decent looking rifle that I thought a lot about.
He can use 450 brass and the 3” RCBS dies work just fine too as the bore of the die is long enough for the longer brass.

I have a Jeffery Farquharson 475No.2 (on offer at Bertram’s right now) as it happens.
If I keep it I have old Kynoch brass and non corrosive Berdan primers as well as a box of bullets that I just bought off gunbroker quite cheap.
So yeah, can all be done with a little patience.
 
Rookhawk, did your friend get the 3-1/4” Manton that Cabelas had?
Decent looking rifle that I thought a lot about.
He can use 450 brass and the 3” RCBS dies work just fine too as the bore of the die is long enough for the longer brass.

I have a Jeffery Farquharson 475No.2 (on offer at Bertram’s right now) as it happens.
If I keep it I have old Kynoch brass and non corrosive Berdan primers as well as a box of bullets that I just bought off gunbroker quite cheap.
So yeah, can all be done with a little patience.

He didn't, but I did see that gun. I think at the end of the "what'll you give us" journey that gun and another (Lyon? Jeffery?) they wanted under $8k for them. Not terrible, but I figured there was a latent defect to last that long at cheap prices in Dallas where a lot of knowledgeable gun enthusiasts got to inspect them in person.

I did see a Farquharson offered by Steve and its a stunner if its the one I'm thinking of.
 
It must be. Has a crescent inlet in the stock which isn’t everybody’s cup of tea.
But that’s all part of it’s history.
 
@rookhawk : I'd much prefer to have a hammer rifle in .500NE, but unfortunately I have not seen many examples of it. I had found multiple .475NE hammer rifles on continental Europe however. Which is why I asked about them.

BTW: why would a ph not allow a hammer rifle for hunting DG?
 
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