Bullets that well advertised but were not that great

[PerH]

On a '90 hunt in Zim I had 5 of what I would call "complete failures " of Winchester Silvertips in 375 H&H.
They grenaded and were each recovered in 4-6 pieces.
I don't know if it was a bad lot...or simply a horrible bullet as I never purchased or shot a single one since.
I pulled the bullets on my remaining rounds and reloaded them with solids.
Spike

I think it was @Hunter-Habib or Professor Mawla that spoke about the altering of the Silvertip without notice .

Going from a strong nickel steel cap and thick jacket to an aluminum tip and soft jacket with other materials mixed in it .

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

I saw a zebra hit with an AFrame pistol bullet and the entire front of the bullet was gone. There was a 44 sized hole through his heart and bullet was under the off side hide. Not a failure in my book but maxed out performance wise.

There's the old saying that gets thrown around that goes "Where in the killing of the animal did the bullet fail?"

I personally don't buy into that logic. I had a bullet shatter into two distinctly different sized pieces on the rib of a mule deer. The much larger piece made an amazing 90 degree right hand turn skipped down the membrane on inside of the rib cage and then eventually exited the animal at the back of the rib cage.

That's right.....two holes on the same side of the deer from the same bullet. And no, it didn't hit any brush, it was a clear shot.

Meanwhile the much smaller piece of the bullet managed to travel thru a lung, the very top of the heart and into the offside lung. The deer ambled up the hill into some brush where it finally went into a death spin spewing blood in like a 6-7 foot circle and collapsed.

So my answer to that question is the bullet failed when it impacted the rib and broke apart. The fact that one of the pieces managed to take the right path into the vitals was just dumb luck.

In your case I'm not sure I'd call that a failure or not. It certainly sounds like a failure to perform as I would expect an A-Frame to. But it ended up performing very much like a Nosler Partition.

 

[Doug3006]

I’ve shot quite a few deer with ballistic tips. I’ve never lost one. The bullet seldom if ever exits. It comes to pieces inside the deer’s chest cavity. Field dressing is a cinch. I just pour out what’s left of the lungs.

Winchester had a bullet called the failsafe. It was OK on deer but not strong enough for elk. They just came apart.

I’ve tried lots of different bullets. I haven’t found one yet that couldn’t cleanly take Whitetail under most circumstances. African game is a different story.

 

[ftrovato]

Obviously, these posts, and the impetus behind them, are based on "personal" experiences...positive or negative.
Personally, I loaded the old Plain Jane Hornady 154 gr BTSP exclusively for my Weatherby 7mm.
It reliably performed on Elk, Deer, Pronghorn, Caribou, and North Slope Grizzly...without failure...from 100 to about 500 yards....and one XXXL Black Bear at around 6-8 ft..
Cheers
Spike

Weatherby has been manufacturing factory ammo with Hornady bullets for as long as I can remember.

For two simple reasons. They shoot well and they kill game!

Congrats on all your success with Hornady! They are the foundation of a lot of shooting that I do from 22-250 Rem to 500 NE.

 

[ftrovato]

There's the old saying that gets thrown around that goes "Where in the killing of the animal did the bullet fail?"

I personally don't buy into that logic. I had a bullet shatter into two distinctly different sized pieces on the rib of a mule deer. The much larger piece made an amazing 90 degree right hand turn skipped down the membrane on inside of the rib cage and then eventually exited the animal at the back of the rib cage.

That's right.....two holes on the same side of the deer from the same bullet. And no, it didn't hit any brush, it was a clear shot.

Meanwhile the much smaller piece of the bullet managed to travel thru a lung, the very top of the heart and into the offside lung. The deer ambled up the hill into some brush where it finally went into a death spin spewing blood in like a 6-7 foot circle and collapsed.

So my answer to that question is the bullet failed when it impacted the rib and broke apart. The fact that one of the pieces managed to take the right path into the vitals was just dumb luck.

In your case I'm not sure I'd call that a failure or not. It certainly sounds like a failure to perform as I would expect an A-Frame to. But it ended up performing very much like a Nosler Partition.

We scrutinize many bullets we remove from the animals THEY kill. Yet THEY did their job!

 

[ftrovato]

I’ve shot quite a few deer with ballistic tips. I’ve never lost one. The bullet seldom if ever exits. It comes to pieces inside the deer’s chest cavity. Field dressing is a cinch. I just pour out what’s left of the lungs.

Winchester had a bullet called the failsafe. It was OK on deer but not strong enough for elk. They just came apart.

I’ve tried lots of different bullets. I haven’t found one yet that couldn’t cleanly take Whitetail under most circumstances. African game is a different story.

I've used Nosler BT for the last 20+ years. Never lost a deer with them and that is the sized game they were intended to be used on.

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

We scrutinize many bullets we remove from the animals THEY kill. Yet THEY did their job!

So my experience with the two holes on same side of deer, you say the bullet did it's job, no failure here at all? Please just asking, no need to shout.

 

[deewayne2003]

Before the thread got really going, I would have bet $5 that most of the entries would be Hornady...didn't turn out exactly that way, but I''m with you. I've been particularly unlucky with the Interlock.

I find that odd and proves to me that opinions are all over the place and while I have no doubt your being honest with your experience.

Interlocks became my go to for deer after using them as a practice substitute for Accubonds in .270win and same for partitions in .300win.

I’ve killed at least 50 whitetail with each of the 140gr BTSP .277 & 180gr BTSP in .300win.

But again, I’ve seen 180gr .300win Balistic Silver Tips fail first hand so many times it’s sad.

 

[Rule 303]

I guess there are several ways to look at this taking it the hit is in the vitals. 1)Bullet hits animal, animal drops there or runs a short distance, bullet worked even if broken in two. 2)Bullet hits animal and animals disappears has to be tracked and found dead quite a distance away, bullet worked. 3)Bullet hits animal and animal runs away or requires more hits, bullet didn't work.

In No1 to me, if the bullet does not perform as it is supposed to then it is a failure and only good luck made it work. In No.2, to me the bullet has not worked properly unless the animal is spooked and adrenalin is up.

So I guess it is upto the individual and their personal standards as to whether the bullet worked or didn't work. This is just my take on the issue.

 

[Stormy Kromer]

I’ve shot quite a few deer with ballistic tips. I’ve never lost one. The bullet seldom if ever exits. It comes to pieces inside the deer’s chest cavity. Field dressing is a cinch. I just pour out what’s left of the lungs.

Winchester had a bullet called the failsafe. It was OK on deer but not strong enough for elk. They just came apart.

I’ve tried lots of different bullets. I haven’t found one yet that couldn’t cleanly take Whitetail under most circumstances. African game is a different story.

I shot got within 75 yards of a bull elk. I got a broad side shot and hit him well with a Fail Safe from my .300 WM. All it did was put a .308 hole through him. Next shot was front on, hit him between both shoulders, went out the other side (his ass). same .308 exit hole. Third shot hit his spine and it was over.

The rest of the Fail Safe ammo I bought from that hunt is still in my closet. It was a .308 solid.

 

[gbflyer]

All you have to do is pull a 35 Whelen loaded with a 250gr Hotcore out of your pocket and any animal in sight will just lay down. No need to look further. Just ask Bob Nelson 35Whelen.

 

[ftrovato]

So my experience with the two holes on same side of deer, you say the bullet did it's job, no failure here at all? Please just asking, no need to shout.

Common sense tells us it’s construction failed. But it provided the desires outcome.

 

[Rule 303]

All you have to do is pull a 35 Whelen loaded with a 250gr Hotcore out of your pocket and any animal in sight will just lay down. No need to look further. Just ask Bob Nelson 35Whelen.

Hard to go wrong with that combination, even better were their 250 grain Grand Slams. Both worked for me. The Grand Slams took a mediocre 1/2 MOA rifle and turned it into a .25MOA rifle.

Yes the animals shot with the Grand Slam appreciated the extra accuracy.
Just getting in ahead of Bob

 

[Flbt]

One problem with most bullets is that you need to use them for what they were intended for.

The Nosler Balistic Tip was never touted as a big game bullet but one that improved accuracy on small game. Berger were a target bullet, until they came out with one that is intended for big game.

John Nosler was dissatisfied with the bullet performance in the late 40's when the bullet that he was shooting didn't do its job on a moose so he went to work and designed the Partition. But that bullet that failed on the moose was quite possibly just fine on smaller game. But on that moose, I have seen them absorb multiple bullets before they just decided to fall down. No matter what the bullet manufacture was.

Ok I agree with you
But they make bt in 35 338 8mm
I know there are a few people that will us bullets that size on small game/ pest
But is there enough of us to make large cal bt
Profitable if they did not expect people to use them on large game?

 

[hoytcanon]

Barns x in 223
They were said to go through deer
I used a 223 on 3 deer one dropped on the spot it was not a pass through
The next ran we found it no pass through
No blood trail
Last one did not find it until the next afternoon
Again no blood trail

The first one was a high shoulder shot did not like the no pass through
So went with behind the shoulder on the next 2 put the 223 up for deer.

I payed 55$ for a box of the 53gr x barns I’d I remember right and spent the money because I believe the bullets would make the 223 at least ok for deer.
At the time I could have gotten Winchester 62 power point for under 20$

Maybe stop shooting deer with a .223.