My Mauser failed me

[Grumpy gumpy]

My 8x68S failed to extract a fired cartridge last night, looked at it this morning and the end of the extractor claw had broken off. It appears to have fractured. It’s most disappointing, I mean if I had been facing a charging rabbit instead of a goat, I could have been mauled….. so much for CRF reliability in the face of dangerous game…. Or it could have been that I was driving around in a landcruiser instead of hanging upside down from a tree by my toes. Now to find another extractor and fit it
Gumpy

 

[Beck]

lol, 8x68s is a great cartridge!

 

[Certus]

Fake news, CRF can’t fail

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

This is the rifle……how can I trust her now…..she has betrayed me…….





Gumpy

 

[cajunchefray]

View attachment 661563
This is the rifle……how can I trust her now…..she has betrayed me…….





Gumpy

Following with interest....
And to learn details?

 

[One Day...]

I am sorry to hear this Grumpy

I have just one question: was your extractor beveled to allow loading the rifle by snapping the extractor over a cartridge already in the chamber, and is this how you used it?

For info, here is what I had posted a while back on the issue:

The misguided practice of beveling the extractor to allow closing the bolt on a cartridge already in the chamber creates two issues:

1) Beveling a Mauser extractor to create the space for it to jump the rim inside the front bridge when closing the bolt, inevitably also creates the space for it to potentially jump the rim when opening the bolt, hence potentially fail to extract. The extractor therefore looses its "Mauser infallibility" and becomes no different from a Remington extractor, or Sako, or etc. etc.​

​

2) Removing material from the extractor to create the space for it to jump the rim automatically weakens it at the two points where it is already the most vulnerable, therefore it CANNOT be as strong as one designed not to do so (this is simple materials physics), AND it creates the possibility for the extractor to be flexed upward which inevitably causes metal fracture, visible when it breaks, or invisible when the fracture is internal before breaking, because it is forced to flex UPWARD, AGAINST ITS RADIUS (the extractor is not flat but radiused to the round contour of the bolt).​

Contrary to popular belief, there is no such thing as a "correctly beveled" extractor. The misunderstanding generally comes from the fact that folks typically do not understand which parts of the extractor is bevelled, and to what purpose. If in addition to beveling the top of the extractor, it is also beveled on the hook to facilitate it slipping over the cartridge in the chamber, this creates two weak points and a possibility of fracture of either or both the extracting hook and the extractor blade. I hope the drawing helps visualize...

If your extractor broke at either of these two points...

... the fix is simple and fail-proof: replace the extractor with one that has not been beveled. Your rifle will instantly return to the original Mauser design and will be 100% reliable.

If what I am discussing is your situation, your rifle did not betray you, but it was betrayed itself when the extractor was misguidedly beveled at the factory or later. Restoring it to its true Mauser design with an unbeveled extractor is easy and will return it to Mauser infallibility.

I hope this helps

 

[BlueFlyer]

Seeing the rifle is buggered and untrustworthy, I will give you $10 to get it out of your sight.

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

It wasn’t modified to "snap over". It was just opened up to take the bigger diameter rim as are thousands of others. No, she betrayed me…..
She abandoned me…love don’t live here anymore….
Gumpy

 

[CoElkHunter]

It wasn’t modified to "snap over". It was just opened up to take the bigger diameter rim as are thousands of others. No, she betrayed me…..
She abandoned me…love don’t live here anymore….
Gumpy

Sell it on here and buy a push feed! LOL

 

[towserthemouser]

I am sorry to hear this Grumpy

I have just one question: was your extractor beveled to allow loading the rifle by snapping the extractor over a cartridge already in the chamber, and is this how you used it?

For info, here is what I had posted a while back on the issue:

The misguided practice of beveling the extractor to allow closing the bolt on a cartridge already in the chamber creates two issues:

1) Beveling a Mauser extractor to create the space for it to jump the rim inside the front bridge when closing the bolt, inevitably also creates the space for it to potentially jump the rim when opening the bolt, hence potentially fail to extract. The extractor therefore looses its "Mauser infallibility" and becomes no different from a Remington extractor, or Sako, or etc. etc.​

​

2) Removing material from the extractor to create the space for it to jump the rim automatically weakens it at the two points where it is already the most vulnerable, therefore it CANNOT be as strong as one designed not to do so (this is simple materials physics), AND it creates the possibility for the extractor to be flexed upward which inevitably causes metal fracture, visible when it breaks, or invisible when the fracture is internal before breaking, because it is forced to flex UPWARD, AGAINST ITS RADIUS (the extractor is not flat but radiused to the round contour of the bolt).​

Contrary to popular belief, there is no such thing as a "correctly beveled" extractor. The misunderstanding generally comes from the fact that folks typically do not understand which parts of the extractor is bevelled, and to what purpose. If in addition to beveling the top of the extractor, it is also beveled on the hook to facilitate it slipping over the cartridge in the chamber, this creates two weak points and a possibility of fracture of either or both the extracting hook and the extractor blade. I hope the drawing helps visualize...

If your extractor broke at either of these two points...
View attachment 661569
... the fix is simple and fail-proof: replace the extractor with one that has not been beveled. Your rifle will instantly return to the original Mauser design and will be 100% reliable.

If what I am discussing is your situation, your rifle did not betray you, but it was betrayed itself when the extractor was misguidedly beveled at the factory or later. Restoring it to its true Mauser design with an unbeveled extractor is easy and will return it to Mauser infallibility.

I hope this helps

@One Day... posts like this are why I LOVE this forum. Thank you for the useful information! This post will be bookmarked and the knowledge filed away in my brain under "Important Mauser Info."

 

[Ontario Hunter]

Changing a 98 Mauser extractor is very easy. Can be done by anyone, even in the field.

I have yet to see a military 98 Mauser extractor that did NOT have the "defective" modifications described above. The extractor that was in my Czech vz.24 when I built it into 404J was clearly unmodified military and it had the "modifications" to claw face and forward end of blade to allow snap over. While it would not surprise me if military manuals advised against closing the bolt on a cartridge dropped in the chamber, it certainly would have been foolish to not machine the extractors to perform snap over in the event a soldier dropped a shell in the chamber either inadvertently or in the heat of a desperate firefight. My Springfield 03A3 has a similarly shaped extractor. I have been snapping over at the range with it since 1964. I didn't know any different. My dad used an 03A3 in combat and he showed me how it's done. I have practiced snap over on my 404 with dummy rounds at least several hundred times. Only issues were shitty RWS brass that was too short (head space incorrect) and has inconsistent rim thickness (both issues cured by switching to Hornady brass) Also, the extractor initially had too much spring tension. This finally became apparent when I could not remove the extractor from the bolt without prying it off with a screwdriver. Extractors are supposed to snap off with finger pressure. To adjust the tension I slightly reshaped the extractor blade by carefully bending it. This also greatly improved bolt face pickup of cartridges from the magazine. Of course, I had to significantly modify the 8mm claw face to accommodate much wider 404J rim. I followed Duane Weibe's instructions and reshaped the extractor to where it would just barely hold it on the bolt face when bolt is removed from the action. I agree with him: a dangerous game rifle is not a dangerous game rifle if it won't snap over on a cartridge dropped in the chamber.

If Mauser extractors were not supposed to snap over, why would the bolts and extractors be machined to make the claw of extractor release from the bolt in forward pressure (closing the bolt) so it can jump over the rim and then lock the extractor to the bolt when the bolt is drawn back to extract? Remove your bolt and you will see how the extractor moves ever so slightly forward and back. The keeper at the head of extractor is smaller than the groove in the bolt head. It's not sloppy machining. That keeper and the groove have a unique shape on the forward face, a hook if you will, that locks the extractor when the bolt is drawn back, but releases the extractor when it's pushed forward. The extractor spring tension was initially so severe that it was not allowing it to move and the extractor was staying locked to the keeper groove during loading which caused sloping shouldered 404 case to be shoved too far into the chamber. Snap over failed. Of course, this would not be an issue with belted cartridges. Then the extractor would either come unlocked or possibly break as belt on case forcibly maintains head space. Check your extractor spring tension!

Here's my 98 Mauser extractor.

And here's a couple of military 98 Mauser extractors for sale on eBay right now.

Clearly these military Mauser extractors were designed to snap over.

 

[CBH Australia]

Just out of interest how old is that trusty old un-fallible CRF Mauser?

It’s probably older than the oldest member here.

Stuff only breaks when you’re using it so at least you make good use of it.

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

My EX- beloved 8x68S is built on a Parker Hale receiver, who knows how old she is, I gave her a facelift, put a new tube on her with a nice fresh hole it it, cleaned her scratches, made her faded blue bits a dark lustrous blue/black, lovingly rubbed oil into her. And how does she treat me……



Gumpy

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

On another note, I found a spare extractor, just need to fit it
Gumpy

 

[Bos en Dal SAFARIS]

It wasn’t modified to "snap over". It was just opened up to take the bigger diameter rim as are thousands of others. No, she betrayed me…..
She abandoned me…love don’t live here anymore….
Gumpy

Sounds like an excuse for a new gun. Trust is earned

 

[CZDiesel]

Should have bought a Winchester jeez!!! jk

 

[mark-hunter]

It appears to have fractured. It’s most disappointing,

How do you load the rifle, usually? (on range, or in hunt)

Do you load by directly placing the round from top, pushing a round to chamber, when extractor snaps over the rim?
Or do you always chamber a round from a magazine?

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

Round in the magazine, push bolt forward, turn handle down, aerate animal ( hopefully) lift handle up, pull bolt back, swear as you’ve just flicked an expensive case over your shoulder
Rinse and repeat

Gumpy

 

[ZG47]

On another note, I found a spare extractor, just need to fit it
Gumpy

And now … poor little @Grumpy gumpy, whose plaintive cries were ignored by the missus, has gotten all the attention that he wanted !
Have a good year.

 

[Grumpy gumpy]

This was tongue in cheek on an actual occurrence that , whilst I like my Mausers, shows they are not infallible , as some will claim. It could be an idea to check the extractor claw on ones firearm to ensure they are in good condition prior to a big hunt, or maybe carry a spare? I would hate for someone to get hurt if it occurred to a Hunter when facing an injured buffalo or heffalump ( childhood reference there) during a charge
And no one commented on my mutilation of the rose Royce song….
Gumpy