One of the worst "examples of hunting" I have seen

[BJH65]

I don't have a problem with shooting an animal from the back of the truck if you've been tracking the animal on foot for days in fair chase or free range area, sometimes this is the only opportunity you'll get. I myself shot a buffalo on my last trip in this manner, but it was on the last afternoon of a 10 day hunt. We had taken two buffalo on foot earlier in the trip. What I do have a problem with is using the back of the truck as a method of hunting.

Not trying to be argumentative but you did use the vehicle as a method of hunting, the only exception was it was the last day of your hunt, which justified that to you. In my mind if it’s acceptable on the last day then it’s acceptable on the first day, if this is simply in regard to one’s personal ethics, the length of the hunt is irrelevant. My preference, like you and most here is to stalk or track the game on foot and either shoot off sticks, various field positions or using a handy tree limb for a rest.

Mark-hunter made some good points. If one can place their shot more accurately from a vehicle and can better insure a killing shot then whose to say it’s truly unethical? Here in North American, most hunting regulations prohibit shooting from a vehicle unless the hunter has a disability. I think it’s ingrained in most of us that shooting from a vehicle is wrong and actually illegal where most of us hunt in North America.

I don’t really have an issue with it even if it’s not my preference whether it’s unfenced Africa or a fenced concession. Maybe you spot a world class bushbuck that’s primed for flight, probably not going to stick around for the 5-6 seconds while you climb out of the bakkie and get on the sticks.

 

[dchum]

I don't have a problem with shooting an animal from the back of the truck if you've been tracking the animal on foot for days in fair chase or free range area, sometimes this is the only opportunity you'll get. I myself shot a buffalo on my last trip in this manner, but it was on the last afternoon of a 10 day hunt. We had taken two buffalo on foot earlier in the trip. What I do have a problem with is using the back of the truck as a method of hunting.

Where did you shoot a “free range” buffalo from a truck?

 

[Beck]

Where did you shoot a “free range” buffalo from a truck?

Well last year it was a fair chase buffalo (my fifth buffalo) on 200k acre plot of land in South Africa. On my first Safari which was a 10 day trip to Coutada Luabo in Mozambique I shot my first buffalo walking and stalking on day one. That trip was an early season trip, and the rains had not hit yet thus burning could not be done - the grass was 8-12' tall throughout the entire concession which made hunting extremely difficult. This was a bucket list father/son hunt. My father never had a chance a buffalo, but he did come close on one when we were riding around on the back of a truck - unfortunately it was a group of cows. If there had been a bull I am sure he would have shot it, and I frankly don't have any problem with that, to each their own.

 

[Beck]

Not trying to be argumentative but you did use the vehicle as a method of hunting, the only exception was it was the last day of your hunt, which justified that to you. In my mind if it’s acceptable on the last day then it’s acceptable on the first day, if this is simply in regard to one’s personal ethics, the length of the hunt is irrelevant. My preference, like you and most here is to stalk or track the game on foot and either shoot off sticks, various field positions or using a handy tree limb for a rest.

Mark-hunter made some good points. If one can place their shot more accurately from a vehicle and can better insure a killing shot then whose to say it’s truly unethical? Here in North American, most hunting regulations prohibit shooting from a vehicle unless the hunter has a disability. I think it’s ingrained in most of us that shooting from a vehicle is wrong and actually illegal where most of us hunt in North America.

I don’t really have an issue with it even if it’s not my preference whether it’s unfenced Africa or a fenced concession. Maybe you spot a world class bushbuck that’s primed for flight, probably not going to stick around for the 5-6 seconds while you climb out of the bakkie and get on the sticks.

Fair enough. I guess I should have said "primary means of hunting". Also I should not have said I have a problem with shooting from the truck, I just don't think it is very much fun.

I certainly prefer to walk and stalk when I hunt in Africa, killing something from the truck ruins part of the fun for me, but in a pinch I'll do it. I couldn't agree with you more on taking an ethical shot, and killing the animal cleanly.

 

[mark-hunter]

In my mind if it’s acceptable on the last day then it’s acceptable on the first day,

The last day of hunt, is definitely a temptation. Not only to shoot from truck but also to shoot less then perfect shot.
For some people, some hunts are literally the hunts of a life time, and the summit of years of savings, and planning. And if they dont get a trophy on last day, maybe they never will.
So, last day of hunt is temptation, and compromises on ethics can easily be made. I cannot condemn this.

 

[buck wild]

@Beck The videos that were removed by this outfit, and others still currently available, weren't just lucky encounters of target animals while driving and quickly taking a shot from the vehicle might have been the only viable chance at a shot. No, these videos depicted the PHs actually running down game, including buffalo, with the vehicle, often into the corners of high fences while clients wailed at them with multiple shots/arrows/rocks whatever they had at their disposal as the vehicle continued to chase the quarry

 

[Beck]

@Beck The videos that were removed by this outfit, and others still currently available, weren't just lucky encounters of target animals while driving and quickly taking a shot from the vehicle might have been the only viable chance at a shot. No, these videos depicted the PHs actually running down game, including buffalo, with the vehicle, often into the corners of high fences while clients wailed at them with multiple shots/arrows/rocks whatever they had at their disposal as the vehicle continued to chase the quarry

I understand, and I am not supporting what those people did. Chasing game around in a truck is unethical, it lacks sport, and hurts our passion. My original post was actually about another filmed hunt that I found unethical, and reported to MOTV. I believe in fair chase hunting.

 

[Beck]

The last day of hunt, is definitely a temptation. Not only to shoot from truck but also to shoot less then perfect shot.
For some people, some hunts are literally the hunts of a life time, and the summit of years of savings, and planning. And if they dont get a trophy on last day, maybe they never will.
So, last day of hunt is temptation, and compromises on ethics can easily be made. I cannot condemn this.

I want to be clear I would never condone chasing game down with a truck.

 

[BJH65]

The last day of hunt, is definitely a temptation. Not only to shoot from truck but also to shoot less then perfect shot.
For some people, some hunts are literally the hunts of a life time, and the summit of years of savings, and planning. And if they dont get a trophy on last day, maybe they never will.
So, last day of hunt is temptation, and compromises on ethics can easily be made. I cannot condemn this.

I’m certain if 15k or more were invested in say a buffalo hunt most would absolutely shoot one on the last day from the bakkie if an opportunity presented itself and it wasn’t feasible to get out and shoot on the sticks. I don’t see this as unethical, just less challenging and less thrilling than stalking one on foot.

 

[deewayne2003]

I try desperately to avoid these discussions/debates like the plague.
That said, I'll break my cardinal rule here, as this is so despicable I'm willing to take the heat.
Some fellows, for reasons known best by them, have a burning desire to be "that guy". The biggest Buck...the most Ducks on a shoot...the largest trophy room... a bigger Bass... and on and on ad nauseum.
Money affords them the ability to achieve those bragging rights...regardless of their skillset.
Case in point.
When I was a Board Director for our local SCI chapter many moons ago, a group of
very well-heeled members put together a Whitetail "hunt" back east on a "ranch". I passed. Three of them went and in 5 days, took three Whitetails that scored between 270-300 points.
Sorry...I don't support or condone shopping for lifestock... and then claiming I went "hunting".
Spike

Agreed, when working in Dallas the excavation company I was with would send 4 “hunters” to a certain high fenced place in Iowa and they would come back with four 200”+ whitetail in a weekend for $100K

If you look at the pics, one of the bucks ears would always be hidden or blood coming from it because of the cattle tags.

But oh man did they love to send those pics out and hang them in the office.

I looked up the ranches website and divided the bucks taken by acres of high fence…..

Came out to one 180”+ buck per 30acres of high fence.

 

[Field28]

Still can't get over the crocodile "hiding" out in that dried up sloot on that one video. If you listen closely, you can hear it coughing up dust from where it was just dropped out of the bakkie.

And that poor damned eland...

 

[Hunt anything]

No doubt that the croc was planted, totally disgusting. I would look mighty hard at a croc hunt in South Africa, I’m sure there are some good hunts in a fair chase hunt but I would definitely do my homework.
On another note on crocs and alligators. At my home in southern Alabama any given piece of water no matter how small it is can have a gator in it. On our farm we had a 10 footer that took over a retention pond that measured less than a tenth of an acre. He stayed for about 2 weeks which was probably long enough for him to clean out every turtle, frog and snake in it. It definitely kept my farm workers on their toes when working in the area!
We live roughly a mile from a river and a mile from a bay, no question he was run off by a bigger gator and would move on to more permanent water.

I saw crocs in mud holes in Mozambique no bigger than a couple of pickup trucks.

 

[Field28]

No doubt that the croc was planted, totally disgusting. I would look mighty hard at a croc hunt in South Africa, I’m sure there are some good hunts in a fair chase hunt but I would definitely do my homework.
On another note on crocs and alligators. At my home in southern Alabama any given piece of water no matter how small it is can have a gator in it. On our farm we had a 10 footer that took over a retention pond that measured less than a tenth of an acre. He stayed for about 2 weeks which was probably long enough for him to clean out every turtle, frog and snake in it. It definitely kept my farm workers on their toes when working in the area!
We live roughly a mile from a river and a mile from a bay, no question he was run off by a bigger gator and would move on to more permanent water.

I saw crocs in mud holes in Mozambique no bigger than a couple of pickup trucks.

I've always heard if it didn't come out of the Limpopo River or parts of Mpumalanga then odds are it's farm raised.

Very true on the alligators, we are damned near overruned with them in coastal SC.
The smaller ones travel to retention ponds through the drainage pipes for miles. The larger ones generally don't travel too far from the rivers. It's very common to see 10-12 foot gators walking across the streets in the neighborhood where my Mom lives. Her neighbor across their pond was taken by a 11 ft female guarding it's nest a couple of years ago.
Didn't eat him, but drowned him and brought him next to mom's driveway in a cove. Still pretty brutal!

 

[DieJager]

I’m certain if 15k or more were invested in say a buffalo hunt most would absolutely shoot one on the last day from the bakkie if an opportunity presented itself and it wasn’t feasible to get out and shoot on the sticks. I don’t see this as unethical, just less challenging and less thrilling than stalking one on foot.

To each his own. I can see doing this with one of the small antelopes, a warthog etc. But not chasing a big 5 animal.

But this illustrates exactly how complex it can be. And how influenced we are by our own standards and people around us. What is sometimes legally is not ethical and vice versa. That said the videos on this thread clearly crossed the line and were unethical.

 

[Flbt]

Fair enough. I guess I should have said "primary means of hunting". Also I should not have said I have a problem with shooting from the truck, I just don't think it is very much fun.

I certainly prefer to walk and stalk when I hunt in Africa, killing something from the truck ruins part of the fun for me, but in a pinch I'll do it. I couldn't agree with you more on taking an ethical shot, and killing the animal cleanly.

Don’t think it’s to much fun hunting form a truck?
I take it you can walk perty well then?
It’s fun a legal in fl.
Really not much different than using a box stand.

And a lot of dog hunters all over use trucks as normal thing

 

[Flbt]

To each his own. I can see doing this with one of the small antelopes, a warthog etc. But not chasing a big 5 animal.

But this illustrates exactly how complex it can be. And how influenced we are by our own standards and people around us. What is sometimes legally is not ethical and vice versa. That said the videos on this thread clearly crossed the line and were unethical.

Legal is not ethical?
How about ethics are meaningless?

Your ethics is that you’re ethics.
Your ethics are not mine and mines not yours.

We are from all over the world hear. There are different norms and practices all over.

I don’t like bow hunting.
That doesn’t mean I care anymore f you do it simply means I am not going to do it.
I dont try and tell you it’s unethical for you.
But it is for me.

 

[HookMeUpII]

It would be helpful for those new to jumping in this post to see the videos. Does anyone have a working link?

 

[Field28]

Here you go

 

[buck wild]

It would be helpful for those new to jumping in this post to see the videos. Does anyone have a working link?

About 2 weeks after I I started this thread, the outfit REMOVED one if the specific videos I was referencing. There’s no doubt the negative publicity got back to them and they quickly pulled it. It was so offensive I can’t believe any rational hunter or PH could have possibly deemed it appropriate for public display.

 

[DieJager]

Legal is not ethical?
How about ethics are meaningless?

Your ethics is that you’re ethics.
Your ethics are not mine and mines not yours.

We are from all over the world hear. There are different norms and practices all over.

I don’t like bow hunting.
That doesn’t mean I care anymore f you do it simply means I am not going to do it.
I dont try and tell you it’s unethical for you.
But it is for me.

Take a moment to breath, now exhale calmly. Then try to re-read what I wrote and then your own reading. Almost the same. I recognize this with your reactions to a lot of posts. Try to leave your emotions out of it. It isn't about you. Just civilized people trying to have a conversation.

To explain my example, what is legal can be unethical.
Where I live I cannot dispatch a mortally wounded wolf. Even if it will certainly die. I can call the wildlife authorities, that will take ages and the wolf will die in pain. The legal way to do things. Fully according the law.

Illegal, but the most ethical would be to end his suffering. Then you will lose your license but ethical. Fully illegal.