Politics

[jruby]

When I was in high-school back in the late 70s there were two tracks - one was college the other was trades. My junior senior year I signed up to go in the Navy so my final year in high-school I took many gedunk courses that were for the trades kids. I aced those courses in high-school.. looking back I don't think the school pushed the trades people hard enough
Just my experience.

 

[BJH65]

Think about how much lower the job market expectations are for kids in college today, how much higher student loan debt is, how much less the dollar buys.

I’m not saying this to be antagonistic, your sentiments are common amongst people your age who simply cannot comprehend how much this country has changed for young people; college graduates today have a MUCH steeper hill to climb.

Hence why they are almost universally engaged in politics, because their suffering the consequences of political decisions that were made long before they were born.

Agreed. A young college student will be approved for a 100k plus student loan, saddled in student debt after graduation and spend a good portion of their lives paying that debt off. Of course if the same student sought a 100k business loan the bank would laugh. It’s almost criminal, really. When I graduated from high school, junior college tuition was free except for books and state universities were very reasonable. Highly recommend the trade schools nowadays.

 

[deewayne2003]

The other thing that the UK and Continental Europe have is a very effective trade school system. A tiny percentage of European students go on to universities compared to the US. Where here someone is racking up $150K in debt for a useless degree in general studies, his or her European counterpart is learning a useful and lucrative trade.

The odd thing to me is the resistance millennials have in embracing such technical and profitable careers for which there is huge demand in this country. Many would seem to be happier complaining about no jobs and greedy Boomers.

I don't see young people shying away from the trades at all, the enrollments for trade schools is through the roof especially in welding, mechanics, aviation maintenance and plumbing.

My department head has been a University employee since graduation 25 years ago and I recently asked his son what his degree was going to be......

"HVAC, I'm going into HVAC, I don't have time to sit in a classroom and listen to people who couldn't feed themselves if not for teaching!"

I've never been more proud of someone I'm not related to!

Trade schools: Why they're grabbing a bigger share of enrollment

Enrollment and projected market growth through 2030 is looking more favorable for the trade schools than broader higher ed.

universitybusiness.com

Trade programs — unlike other areas of higher education — are in hot demand

Many young people choose to pursue short-term credentials over traditional college because they see them as a quicker and a more affordable path to a good job

hechingerreport.org

Trade School Enrollment Surges Post-Pandemic, Outpacing Traditional Universities

Trade School enrollment outpaces traditional universities, with significant growth in Healthcare and Culinary Arts, reports Validated Insights.

www.businesswire.com

 

[275r7x57]

I don't see young people shying away from the trades at all, the enrollments for trade schools is through the roof especially in welding, mechanics, aviation maintenance and plumbing.

My department head has been a University employee since graduation 25 years ago and I recently asked his son what his degree was going to be......

"HVAC, I'm going into HVAC, I don't have time to sit in a classroom and listen to people who couldn't feed themselves if not for teaching!"

I've never been more proud of someone I'm not related to!

Trade schools: Why they're grabbing a bigger share of enrollment

Enrollment and projected market growth through 2030 is looking more favorable for the trade schools than broader higher ed.

universitybusiness.com

Trade programs — unlike other areas of higher education — are in hot demand

Many young people choose to pursue short-term credentials over traditional college because they see them as a quicker and a more affordable path to a good job

hechingerreport.org

Trade School Enrollment Surges Post-Pandemic, Outpacing Traditional Universities

Trade School enrollment outpaces traditional universities, with significant growth in Healthcare and Culinary Arts, reports Validated Insights.

www.businesswire.com

Agree. I went to a Vo-Tec school program for a portion of my last 2 years in HS (I hated sitting in the classroom and my grade we not the greatest.). After HS I sat on the Vo-Tec board for several years and the program had a 90% job placement and retention success rate.

90% of the guys we hire are either for an existing trade or right out of a trade school.

 

[Mark A Ouellette]

Agreed and your SIL had a very smart approach, but I'd be willing to bet that he comes from educated and successful parents that gave him guidance on how to maneuver in the educational system.

The disconnect between you're and Mdwests statements is that the examples you give are for people who have good guidance at home, when the reality is that the majority of youth are being told what's the most financially convenient for the parents or more often than not NO GUIDANCE AT ALL.

The old saying of....

"Wealthy people teach their children to thrive and poor people teach their children to survive."


Just because you don't come from wealthy and or educated parents doesn't mean you deserve to be fed feet first into a financial woodchipper; however if given the proper guidance and a fare chance to make meaningful economic gains Gen Z and younger will make us proud if only given the same opportunities that were available in 1970.

God bless the United States Marine Corps, at least for me and young farm boys and girls like I was. God please also bless the other U.S. military services for the guidance and occasional size 10 boot rammed up assess when appropriate! I’ve heard VP J.D. Vance thank his Gunnery Sergeant (paygrade E-7) for direction. Prior to his Gunny, J.D. Vance had his grandmother for stern guidance.

My parents raised me to be good and work hard, very hard. Coming from a strict home and quick tempered father on the farm, Marine Corps boot camp was easy for me! I did well in my Marine Corps career based on hard work and figuring out how to do the impossible with next to nothing. Sounds like farming, doesn’t it?

In two decades as a Marine and almost three has a technology consultant, those I most admire to a person had very mentoring parents. It was hard for me to conceive that their families would discuss politics, the economy, and how to make money around the dinner table.

In retrospect, I had the same opportunities as all others. I just lacked the foundation to understand what to do with the opportunities. Presently I have young adult stepchildren that I mentor nearly every day, rather they like it or not. I strive to implant in them the foundation to achieve much in life.

The U.S. military is a social melting pot and social elevator all at once. The great thing is there is something for every young person in the services. That is for those that qualify. Enlisting now requires nearly perfect medical records, no criminal records, and so on. Gosh knows I enlisted with five knitting needle size stainless steel pins in my hip and nearly got arrested two days prior to entering boot camp! I would have been arrested if the WWII vet I offended hadn’t figured that the Corps would remove any mental deficiencies from my brain housing group. Advance 50 years to today and police do not have the discretion to let youthful defenders go with a stern lecture or to allow their parents to punish the stupid kid.

For many young people and a lot of older ones who need a fresh start in life, the country needs something between military service and college. Something like the Civilian Conservation Corps of the 1930’s. A program where if young people would follow the rules they would learn a trade but with a payback to America. I think the AmeriCorps program did or does this for teachers. We need to create more learning opportunities for people to better themselves. Programs such as those would be a better use of my tax dollars than a lot of other questionable Government programs.

 

[Altitude sickness]

Mark, for hiring practices. If I was forced to pick from one demographic. On average, I would hire a farm kid all day long.

Of course there are no absolutes. but they can pretty much drive anything, are used to cobbling and wrenching and of course, working hard.

 

[Scott CWO]

Read that this was a big issue ...so he sorted it....

Donald Trump signs order to 'make America's showers great again'

The US president says he wants to "take care of my beautiful hair" as he eases water flow rules.

www.bbc.com

Clothes washing machines are what really suck.

 

[Scott CWO]

Yep.


LSE is considered to be one of the top 10 business schools on earth.. by comparison, the Univ of Akron is the 377th place business school in the US..

But LSE is less than 1/2 the price..

The US higher education system is a complete disaster when you consider it exclusively from an ROI perspective..

This equation is precisely why I pursued my MBA at Anglia Ruskin University in the UK... ARU is largely unknown in the US.. but is a reasonably well regarded school in the UK.. Founded in the 1800's, accredited, etc etc..

At the time I was shopping for a school the University of TN (similar quality MBA program) was $44K to attend their EMBA.. ARU cost me $9200 from start to finish.. For me it was a no brainer.. I wasn't going to go to a tier 1 or tier 2 school... I simply needed an MBA from somewhere for career progression...

And who wouldn't want to be an alumni from the same university as David Gilmour and Syd Barret from Pink Floyd?

One of the best bands ever! But not just because I’ve become Comfortably Numb.

 

[rookhawk]

Mark, for hiring practices. If I was forced to pick from one demographic. On average, I would hire a farm kid all day long.

Of course there are no absolutes. but they can pretty much drive anything, are used to cobbling and wrenching and of course, working hard.

I'd adjust that sentiment only slightly. I'd hire rural kids.

When I was a kid, the COOL kids got jobs at McDonalds. Everyone was in awe of those kids that nailed an interview and got jobs. Work was aspirational.

Today in suburban areas, the LOSER kids had to have jobs. You know the ones, poor, maybe even <gulp> from middle class stock. Having to have a job as a teen is viewed with much condescension by the majority of teenagers.

We're now in a rural area and virtually all the kids have jobs, those that don't are viewed poorly as rude, bad interviewers, weak work ethic, not going places.

As an aside, I'm noticing a correlation with driver's licenses too. The rural go-getters are getting licenses on their 16th birthday and finding freedom ASAP, the suburban kids have far less interest in even possessing a driver's license.

 

[jruby]

If given a second chance knowing what I know now. I would have worked as an electrician. I was an electricians mate during my time in service. At that time I worked on everthing up to 440v circuits. Trying to find a good electrician now is difficult. I am within seven years of retiring now so it's too late to change carreers.

 

[Brent in Az]

Trump's budget bill passes the house 216-214.
Now comes the Senate Hurdle.

 

[Scott CWO]

I don't see young people shying away from the trades at all, the enrollments for trade schools is through the roof especially in welding, mechanics, aviation maintenance and plumbing.

My department head has been a University employee since graduation 25 years ago and I recently asked his son what his degree was going to be......

"HVAC, I'm going into HVAC, I don't have time to sit in a classroom and listen to people who couldn't feed themselves if not for teaching!"

I've never been more proud of someone I'm not related to!

Trade schools: Why they're grabbing a bigger share of enrollment

Enrollment and projected market growth through 2030 is looking more favorable for the trade schools than broader higher ed.

universitybusiness.com

Trade programs — unlike other areas of higher education — are in hot demand

Many young people choose to pursue short-term credentials over traditional college because they see them as a quicker and a more affordable path to a good job

hechingerreport.org

Trade School Enrollment Surges Post-Pandemic, Outpacing Traditional Universities

Trade School enrollment outpaces traditional universities, with significant growth in Healthcare and Culinary Arts, reports Validated Insights.

www.businesswire.com

My future SIL (July wedding costing me an African safari) comes from a wealthy family owning childcare centers and preschools but he didn’t want to work in that field so he went to both an aerospace trade school and an HVAC trade school. He had immediate job offers after graduation. Surprisingly, he chose an HVAC job because he thought it would be more stable and not dependent on government contracts coming and going. He was one of two graduates hired by one of his instructors that also owns a big HVAC business. He loves the work and works as much overtime as he wants and is making good money. My daughter is an orthopedic surgical nurse and works three twelve hour shifts Tuesday-Thursday. Together, they plan to start fixing and flipping houses as a side business after the wedding.

 

[HookMeUpII]

"HVAC, I'm going into HVAC, I don't have time to sit in a classroom and listen to people who couldn't feed themselves if not for teaching!"

One of my best friend's does HVAC with his father. It's just him, his father, one van. They do no installs. Only service/replacements of existing equipment. They refer all new installs out. They are in a wealthy area of northern NJ.

At this point I have to imagine they are clearing $1mm a year or more. They work incredibly hard, but that's a lot of money.

 

[mdwest]

The most financially successful young adult in my family so far is one of my nephews.. he chose the trade school route.. went to A&P school (jet engine).. he's only about 5 years into his career at this point, and is living the dream.. he works as the senior mechanic (team lead) on a traveling team that basically flies around the country (sometimes internationally) and fixes commercial aircraft at locations where qualified mechanics arent available..

Hes seeing the world, making north of $120K a year and still hasn't had his 26th birthday yet..

If/when he decides he wants to come off the road and settle down somewhere, he's already had offers from 2 major airlines and is pretty sure he can walk into FedX anytime he likes (he knows one of the senior leaders in the FedX shop really well)..

 

[deewayne2003]

God bless the United States Marine Corps, at least for me and young farm boys and girls like I was. God please also bless the other U.S. military services for the guidance and occasional size 10 boot rammed up assess when appropriate! I’ve heard VP J.D. Vance thank his Gunnery Sergeant (paygrade E-7) for direction. Prior to his Gunny, J.D. Vance had his grandmother for stern guidance.

My parents raised me to be good and work hard, very hard. Coming from a strict home and quick tempered father on the farm, Marine Corps boot camp was easy for me! I did well in my Marine Corps career based on hard work and figuring out how to do the impossible with next to nothing. Sounds like farming, doesn’t it?

In two decades as a Marine and almost three has a technology consultant, those I most admire to a person had very mentoring parents. It was hard for me to conceive that their families would discuss politics, the economy, and how to make money around the dinner table.

In retrospect, I had the same opportunities as all others. I just lacked the foundation to understand what to do with the opportunities. Presently I have young adult stepchildren that I mentor nearly every day, rather they like it or not. I strive to implant in them the foundation to achieve much in life.

The U.S. military is a social melting pot and social elevator all at once. The great thing is there is something for every young person in the services. That is for those that qualify. Enlisting now requires nearly perfect medical records, no criminal records, and so on. Gosh knows I enlisted with five knitting needle size stainless steel pins in my hip and nearly got arrested two days prior to entering boot camp! I would have been arrested if the WWII vet I offended hadn’t figured that the Corps would remove any mental deficiencies from my brain housing group. Advance 50 years to today and police do not have the discretion to let youthful defenders go with a stern lecture or to allow their parents to punish the stupid kid.

For many young people and a lot of older ones who need a fresh start in life, the country needs something between military service and college. Something like the Civilian Conservation Corps of the 1930’s. A program where if young people would follow the rules they would learn a trade but with a payback to America. I think the AmeriCorps program did or does this for teachers. We need to create more learning opportunities for people to better themselves. Programs such as those would be a better use of my tax dollars than a lot of other questionable Government programs.

You hit the bullseye as usual Mark!

A good friend of mine was born into a bad situation and told me about having to make trips with his mother to the food bank, he worked construction for a little while and then joined the army.

3 tours in Iraq and 19 years later he is a Command Sargent Major in the Airborne with a beautiful wife and nice house in Austin and is genuinely one of the finest people I know. The last time I saw him he told me that he is now taking college classes and working towards a degree.

He frequently speaks about how many people have been lifted out of poverty by armed service.

As for the Civilian Conservation Corp, I like the idea of a modern one but would put my own twist on it.......
Mark Twain said "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness"

My idea would be to require all high school students to spend at least 6 months living abroad and working on projects to help developing nations, not only to get the travel and language experience but to also give the privileged minority a glimpse of how people live in a world where only 1:50 has running water as well as giving those from modest means the chance to see the world that largely they wouldn't otherwise have a chance to experience.

 

[HookMeUpII]

The most financially successful young adult in my family so far is one of my nephews.. he chose the trade school route.. went to A&P school (jet engine).. he's only about 5 years into his career at this point, and is living the dream.. he works as the senior mechanic (team lead) on a traveling team that basically flies around the country (sometimes internationally) and fixes commercial aircraft at locations where qualified mechanics arent available..

Hes seeing the world, making north of $120K a year and still hasn't had his 26th birthday yet..

If/when he decides he wants to come off the road and settle down somewhere, he's already had offers from 2 major airlines and is pretty sure he can walk into FedX anytime he likes (he knows one of the senior leaders in the FedX shop really well)..

Just make sure he stays on track. My nephew rubbed it in his father (my best friend) and my face out of college. We tried to get him jobs with a decent salary. He had offers making $70-$80k right out of college. His response was "No thanks. I want to make more." We called him crazy. He took a job in medical device sales making $350k to start, absolutely killing it.

5 years later he's in trouble. He's out of money, made some bad company moves, and we think he's dealing with some vices. He fell into the social media trap. The trap of thinking what he sees on there is really making it. We all know that's a giant facade.

Hopefully, your nephew keeps it rolling with that good momentum. Lots of pitfalls for young men these days.

 

[CJW]

Yesterday, a dude walked by me wearing a dress.

Yuck!

 

[BJH65]

Mark Ouellette’s above post brings back many fond memories of Marine Corps boot camp. While I had worked on both cattle and sheep ranches for several years as a teen and my uncles farm, and being somewhat mature and responsible for my age, I have to admit I was still a punk at 18.

I joined the Marines right out of high school at 18. I still remember with clarity my first couple of days in boot camp when the processing week drill instructor was instructing us on how to make our “racks” that’s beds to non marines and sailors, with 45 degree hospital corners and so tight you could bounce a quarter off it. I couldn’t see very well, others were blocking my view, so I walked up behind the drill instructor and poked him in the back with my finger, asking him to show us again. I did ask politely . Then the D.I. erupted into a human volcano, “You assaulted me! I will PT you until you f@#$ing die!” Which he then proceeded to do!

Later on, when assigned to our primary platoon, while being berated by our senior drill instructor, I rolled my eyes and was immediately c clamped by my throat and shaken like a rag doll for several seconds by one of the junior drill instructors. He released the hold before I blacked out. He then ripped name tag off and said, “I’m going to remember you, you’re going to be my special project!” For the entirety of our 3 month plus boot camp, this Sgt. was true to his word, PT’ing me all the time and at all hours until I was in such good shape it didn’t even bother me, I was almost impervious to pain! I still remember being outside at night doing pushups in the mud with the Sgt saying, “I’m gonna make a marine out of you yet!”

Even 41 years ago, I don’t think it was too common for D.I’s to physically “correct” a private, the drill instructors were more subtle, usually a physical form of correction took place during drills where it could be masked better or the more grueling non stop PT’ing, endless mountain climbers, push ups, sit-ups, side straddle hops, etc.. but, I guess my point was I damn sure needed it!

Perhaps midway through boot camp, I remember being questioned by our platoon commander, 1st Lt Nicholson, asking if I was ever assaulted by the D.I’s. I believe this was a routine requirement. Not even for a second did I consider saying I was. Lt Nicholson went on to a distinguished career in the marines attaining the rank of Lt. General. A great man and leader.

Without question my time in the marines instilled much needed discipline, teamwork and leadership that greatly helped me in my law enforcement career and in life. I am truly indebted to the Marine Corps. Semper Fi!

 

[275r7x57]

Just make sure he stays on track. My nephew rubbed it in his father (my best friend) and my face out of college. We tried to get him jobs with a decent salary. He had offers making $70-$80k right out of college. His response was "No thanks. I want to make more." We called him crazy. He took a job in medical device sales making $350k to start, absolutely killing it.

5 years later he's in trouble. He's out of money, made some bad company moves, and we think he's dealing with some vices. He fell into the social media trap. The trap of thinking what he sees on there is really making it. We all know that's a giant facade.

Hopefully, your nephew keeps it rolling with that good momentum. Lots of pitfalls for young men these days.

Life is not easy. It does not matter if you make 1m or $1. It all can be spent. Most people have no concept of what a $1 is or what it takes make one. Most live way beyond their means rich and poor.

Last year we had a distant neighbor win 50k on a lottery ticket, next morning he quit his above average job and told everyone at the local coffee shop that he and his family would never work again. 3 months went by and he was begging for his job back. Point being that he had no concept of money. He never had 50k in his life, probably never had 1-3K at any given time in his life, so 50k was like winning 5m to him and he thought it would never run out.

Just like most need a structured work environment, most need a structured savings program. Most can not voluntarily set money aside each week or month and not stick their hands in it and spend it.

 

[Red Leg]

Life is not easy. It does not matter if you make 1m or $1. It all can be spent. Most people have no concept of what a $1 is or what it takes make one. Most live way beyond their means rich and poor.

Last year we had a distant neighbor win 50k on a lottery ticket, next morning he quit his above average job and told everyone at the local coffee shop that he and his family would never work again. 3 months went by and he was begging for his job back. Point being that he had no concept of money. He never had 50k in his life, probably never had 1-3K at any given time in his life, so 50k was like winning 5m to him and he thought it would never run out.

Just like most need a structured work environment, most need a structured savings program. Most can not voluntarily set money aside each week or month and not stick their hands in it and spend it.

Over 50K?