Reality Check, Sad News

[gillettehunter]

I could be wrong but I think he has been there for 30 yrs and employed 100 game scouts to for anti poaching on his hunting blocks. His are not the first that have been returned and will not be the last. It is possible that a new operator could come in but, not too likely when an established company was losing money...... The US and Tanz Government both have to share the blame. Plenty to go around. The animals will however, pay the price......
Bruce

 

[AfricaHunting.com]

Very sad to hear. Eric and his. family were part of an amazing era, a moment in time which will not be forgotten by them nor their clients. They fought hard and did so much for Tanzania for many decades, we now can only hope that the government puts immediately the necessary resources in place to control these areas.


Big Elephant hunted in Tanzania/Selous with PH Eric Pasanisi (left) and Jean-louis Masson. 83.77 pounds (38 kilograms) and 73.22 inches (2.10 meters)

 

[Dragan N.]

This is very sad.
Interesting to me that the blame is mostly put on the US? Don’t other countries hunt Africa? Not trying to defend USFWS, just sounds like the only hunters in the world are US. I know that’s far from true. UK, Germany, Portugal pretty much started the hunting scene in Africa. Where are they in all this?

I recall on one video I watched a safari outfitter said that something like 70-80% of their clientele comes from the US. So if 70-80% of your clientele is wiped from your business- it is rather difficult to stay in business. If UK, Germany, and Portugal instead ban imports- well its easier to recover from a 20-30% lose of your revenue than a 70-80%.

I feel like banning the importation of trophies is a cause but as much blame if not more is on the Tanzania government. The government fees to hunt Tanzania have gotten ridiculous. Also some of their rules around licenses for plains game also I am assuming hurt operators. I understand that Tanzania is/was the premier hunting location for a long time and that comes with a premium, but the government got greedy IMO.

This particular article references the lose of elephant and lion hunts as being the driving factor of the outfit closing. I would imagine that an elephant or lion hunt in Tanzania would easily be between 50-100K. At these costs these huts typically appeal to the just put send me the bill and if you have to ask you can't afford it crowd. Tanzania was geared towards these hunters- so they could definitely afford to charge the huge premium. Their target audience was a very different crowd from I think most plains games hunter who are more "average" people. I would guess if Tanzania wants its hunting industry to survive they may have to bring their prices down and appeal more to the later. Although I doubt it will happen.

I think part of the reason you are seeing a decline in hunter numbers across North America for instance is the cost. In some areas its just getting to expensive for people, who may otherwise be interested, to take it up as a hobby.

 

[edward]

Sierra, a lot/most/some of the costs needed to operate in certain Countries is mandated by concession costs, taxes, community services/donations etc etc etc which are mandated by the Government of the country and to a lessor, but non-the-less contributing, factor local Governements and Community leaders etc.

Try and think that "If it pays, it stays"
and if it don't pay well..........................

Both you and I could probably never afford a hunt with the likes of the Pasinisi's but the revenue they created,
the areas they managed,
the wildlife they protected,
the game scouts they employed,
the local benefits they provided to the local communities were very FAR reaching.

Sure, the likes of you and me were still likely to never have benifited from any of this DIRECTLY but indirectly they kept commercial safari hunting on the map, they secured 10'000 of km's2 of sensitive country from poachers they employed hundreds of local people who without that work would probably be poaching, out of necessity themselves.

Who is going to protect those areas NOW !

Kenya, shut down sport hunting in 1980.
Is their wildlife population exploding ?
India, shut down sport hunting 1978. Has it saved the Tiger ?

Exclusion from safari hunting, which in itself is nothing more than an interactive animal husbandry tool, will NOT save wildlife.

Let history note the contributions of the anti hunting lobby groups and the U.S.F.W.S have made to the decimation of populations of wildlife Worldwide.

Make no mistake.

You, meaning everyone here, may have never had a plan to hunt Tanzania, nor with the Pasinisi's, and may think that this decision is simply another operator closing the doors and it will not effect you, well you are wrong.
The ripple effect of this decision will effect A LOT of people in A LOT of different countries and is already being framed by people that know a lot more about all of this than me as the beginning of the END.

This news, to me, is tradgic, depressing and regretful.

I feel like there has been a death in the family.

A DEATH IN ALL OUR FAMILY'S.

 

[BRICKBURN]

I feel like banning the importation of trophies is a cause but as much blame if not more is on the Tanzania government. The government fees to hunt Tanzania have gotten ridiculous. Also some of their rules around licenses for plains game also I am assuming hurt operators. I understand that Tanzania is/was the premier hunting location for a long time and that comes with a premium, but the government got greedy IMO.

For the folks who could afford the hunts were affording them for years.
Obviously the inability to import trophies certainly changed the game.

 

[edward]

THE END IS GETTING CLOSER...

A message & reality check from a pioneer hunting family in Tanzania. A family that gave so much to the cause. This is a sad day for us all.

"I confirm that I surrendered all my hunting blocks of all my companies today.

My family has been the longest operating company in Tanzania- for more than 40 years.

We have been the biggest operator in Tanzania and all of Africa.

We have held the largest part of the Selous, with prime blocks, the same since 1978 which I finished surrendering all today.

We have gone from 126 safaris per year to a handful because of the closure of US elephant and lion trophy imports.

We cannot book enough 21 day safaris to make a profit or stay in business without lion and elephant imports into the US. Our losses are escalating so I have to stop.

When U.S. elephant and lion hunting imports were threatened we stepped up our anti-poaching to 2.4 million dollars in three years.

We by ourselves funded 100 Selous Game Scouts for many years. You saw our books and took copies of our ledger sheets for US authorities.

You saw the newspaper clippings of the vehicles and plane our foundation delivered.

You even attended the public ceremonies with the Minister remember the work done!!.

I know that Warden of the Selous wrote to the U.S. how important our presence was to control poaching in the Selous.

At the same time I have donated many full safaris to Shikar for auction to fund the $ 500,000 for lion studies and aging, work that was ignored by USFWS, perhaps because of Craig Packer, I do not know!!!

The efforts of Tanzania, of my companies and foundation have been completely ignored by USFWS, so we have already been operating at a loss for too long it is time to stop and I cannot guarantee that the biodiversity of the hunting areas will not be lost now!.

Our involvement in anti-poaching has become almost zero this year because our income losses. I think that the decisions by USFWS will eventually exterminate all Tanzania wildlife outside National Parks because of their determination to stop the importation of trophies into the US.

Everything will end very quickly and wildlife will disappear in these areas that represent almost 1/3 of Tanzania territory.

I have already returned 10 blocks the past years and with no hunters in the field it is going to be very difficult to save our last elephants.

Our poor elephants, our poor animals, SHAME on….!!!!

The real truth is that everyone does not care and nobody can realize the irreversible damage caused by such decisions. It is certainly the END OF THE GAME if your governments do not realize and help Tanzania.

Anyway, It is already too late for me, and soon it will be too late for other outfitters."

Kind regards
Eric Pasanisi

Big Elenpahnt hunted in Tanzania with PH Francois Lyonnet at Pasanisi 72.75 pounds (33 kilograms)

WILL YOU STILL BE IN BUSINESS IN ANY OTHER AFRICAN COUNTRY?

 

[LivingTheDream]

For the folks who could afford the hunts were affording them for years.
Obviously the inability to import trophies certainly changed the game.

Yeah I get it, I just feel that Tanzania could have done something to help the outfitters continue a viable business. Just a sad situation all the way around.

 

[ActionBob]

So I guess the idea of lowering costs, fees and taxes, at least for PG hunting, to get more hunters into the country was not an option?

David, I know you so I'm pretty sure I can be a bit direct with you and you will be understanding... But I direct this to several others on this thread as well.

I fear you are missing some of realities of hunting in a place like this. Yes the government fees are high.... Probably worse is the un-reliability and how they may at the drop of a hat change the fees and/or tack on huge surcharges last minute... After the seasons booking are made. However I had heard that the Outfitters had been able to get the ear of those officials and bring some reality back into it. I do not see this as a large contributor to this downfall.

To further address your questions, there have been some seriously good deals offered as Outfitters have gotten more creative in their marketing. Especially for Buffalo and leopard as they strive to stay in business with lions and elephants on the menu. I think lion was the straw that broke the backs... Elephant surely hurt but elephant had been poached so relentlessly that there were really not good hunt-able populations left in many areas. In fact I believe Tanzania herself was trying to conserve the big bulls best she could with resources available... For example, I believe they would not allow a foreign hunter to receive a permit to hunt an elephant unless he had an import permit to take the trophies home. Thus conserving those valuable bulls for more high priced hunts to clients who can import them... Unlike Zimbabwe which has so many elephants they need hunting of them irregardless of what they sell for. And one more thing on elephant, I spoke to several Outfitters who operate there and they actually did not want to hunt elephants as they wished to rebuild populations... We must respect those outfitters for spending what they did and still do on anti poaching to protect animals they do not immediately benefit from.

I digress though, back to the PG hunts. Have you looked at the cost of getting there? And have you looked at the trophy fees for PG? They are really very reasonable once you have your licence and are there! However please try to realize the logistics required to support you hunting out that far from any civilization. And look into the travel expense to get there.

I have looked into it. On a per head basis, a 21 day hunt in Tanzania is really one of the better buys in Africa! The problem is it costs a large amount all at once. And many of us choose to go more places and do smaller hunts more often.... Hunting Tanzania is not in the Bill of Rights. In fact in the United States of America, we are guaranteed the right to "the pursuit of happiness". We are not guaranteed to attain it.

So I've never made it there, but let me give you some real life examples of my trip to Mozambique to hunt with Simon @Traditional Mozambique Safaris. I think it gave me some insight as to what it takes to get to those remote areas..... Fly to Joberg, overnight... Same as you might do to go hunt with an outfit like @Pawprint Safaris ,as you have done. But then you need a visa for Moz. In my case that required not one but two trips to the Conciliate. Ok, back to the airport... Flight was cancelled, another overnight while behind the scenes Simon is working to find another flight. Next morning we are on our way but a different route... And at the cost of another commercial flight. On a desperate schedule to reach our charter flight that is scheduled. Simon had negotiated a great deal on that and it got me an extra day of hunting on each end of the trip... But it still cost $3200 and I was in danger of having to pay the pilot for an overnight if we were late.. It all works out, barely! The Charter pilot is at the air terminal as we land and ushers me through as quick as possible... Run to the other end of town (ok, not a big town) to clear guns through the Police.. We are finally airborne in the Cessna 206. Land and Simon's guys are there to meet us in two Land Cruisers... We need to drive several hours yet, stopping along the way for various supplies. We finally arrive at camp.. .Then hunting and fixing tires out in the bush... Ice maker is broken so the assistant PH has to make regular runs to town for fresh produce, etc and ice.. oh and beer That's a good 10 hour day, much closer than in the Selous In fact in most or all of the Selous, I'm not sure it is doable without a plane. Then on the way home, I stayed until the last possible day, so had to get back and did so without any hotel stays... 60 hours and 6 flights from the time I got out of bed at camp until I got home to my own bed.

It is just not the same as hunting in South Africa. It is so much more and this is why it is such a tragedy to be looking at possibly losing these areas forever. But I don't think it is fair to think that it could be saved by different pricing schemes. There is just more to it.

 

[Dr Ray]

THE END IS GETTING CLOSER...

A message & reality check from a pioneer hunting family in Tanzania. A family that gave so much to the cause. This is a sad day for us all.

"I confirm that I surrendered all my hunting blocks of all my companies today.

My family has been the longest operating company in Tanzania- for more than 40 years.

We have been the biggest operator in Tanzania and all of Africa.

We have held the largest part of the Selous, with prime blocks, the same since 1978 which I finished surrendering all today.

We have gone from 126 safaris per year to a handful because of the closure of US elephant and lion trophy imports.

We cannot book enough 21 day safaris to make a profit or stay in business without lion and elephant imports into the US. Our losses are escalating so I have to stop.

When U.S. elephant and lion hunting imports were threatened we stepped up our anti-poaching to 2.4 million dollars in three years.

We by ourselves funded 100 Selous Game Scouts for many years. You saw our books and took copies of our ledger sheets for US authorities.

You saw the newspaper clippings of the vehicles and plane our foundation delivered.

You even attended the public ceremonies with the Minister remember the work done!!.

I know that Warden of the Selous wrote to the U.S. how important our presence was to control poaching in the Selous.

At the same time I have donated many full safaris to Shikar for auction to fund the $ 500,000 for lion studies and aging, work that was ignored by USFWS, perhaps because of Craig Packer, I do not know!!!

The efforts of Tanzania, of my companies and foundation have been completely ignored by USFWS, so we have already been operating at a loss for too long it is time to stop and I cannot guarantee that the biodiversity of the hunting areas will not be lost now!.

Our involvement in anti-poaching has become almost zero this year because our income losses. I think that the decisions by USFWS will eventually exterminate all Tanzania wildlife outside National Parks because of their determination to stop the importation of trophies into the US.

Everything will end very quickly and wildlife will disappear in these areas that represent almost 1/3 of Tanzania territory.

I have already returned 10 blocks the past years and with no hunters in the field it is going to be very difficult to save our last elephants.

Our poor elephants, our poor animals, SHAME on….!!!!

The real truth is that everyone does not care and nobody can realize the irreversible damage caused by such decisions. It is certainly the END OF THE GAME if your governments do not realize and help Tanzania.

Anyway, It is already too late for me, and soon it will be too late for other outfitters."

Kind regards
Eric Pasanisi

Big Elenpahnt hunted in Tanzania with PH Francois Lyonnet at Pasanisi 72.75 pounds (33 kilograms)

This is a very sad day for you, and for us too! I’m so sorry to see this happen.

 

[sierraone]

David, I know you so I'm pretty sure I can be a bit direct with you and you will be understanding... But I direct this to several others on this thread as well.

I fear you are missing some of realities of hunting in a place like this. Yes the government fees are high.... Probably worse is the un-reliability and how they may at the drop of a hat change the fees and/or tack on huge surcharges last minute... After the seasons booking are made. However I had heard that the Outfitters had been able to get the ear of those officials and bring some reality back into it. I do not see this as a large contributor to this downfall.

To further address your questions, there have been some seriously good deals offered as Outfitters have gotten more creative in their marketing. Especially for Buffalo and leopard as they strive to stay in business with lions and elephants on the menu. I think lion was the straw that broke the backs... Elephant surely hurt but elephant had been poached so relentlessly that there were really not good hunt-able populations left in many areas. In fact I believe Tanzania herself was trying to conserve the big bulls best she could with resources available... For example, I believe they would not allow a foreign hunter to receive a permit to hunt an elephant unless he had an import permit to take the trophies home. Thus conserving those valuable bulls for more high priced hunts to clients who can import them... Unlike Zimbabwe which has so many elephants they need hunting of them irregardless of what they sell for. And one more thing on elephant, I spoke to several Outfitters who operate there and they actually did not want to hunt elephants as they wished to rebuild populations... We must respect those outfitters for spending what they did and still do on anti poaching to protect animals they do not immediately benefit from.

I digress though, back to the PG hunts. Have you looked at the cost of getting there? And have you looked at the trophy fees for PG? They are really very reasonable once you have your licence and are there! However please try to realize the logistics required to support you hunting out that far from any civilization. And look into the travel expense to get there.

I have looked into it. On a per head basis, a 21 day hunt in Tanzania is really one of the better buys in Africa! The problem is it costs a large amount all at once. And many of us choose to go more places and do smaller hunts more often.... Hunting Tanzania is not in the Bill of Rights. In fact in the United States of America, we are guaranteed the right to "the pursuit of happiness". We are not guaranteed to attain it.

So I've never made it there, but let me give you some real life examples of my trip to Mozambique to hunt with Simon @Traditional Mozambique Safaris. I think it gave me some insight as to what it takes to get to those remote areas..... Fly to Joberg, overnight... Same as you might do to go hunt with an outfit like @Pawprint Safaris ,as you have done. But then you need a visa for Moz. In my case that required not one but two trips to the Conciliate. Ok, back to the airport... Flight was cancelled, another overnight while behind the scenes Simon is working to find another flight. Next morning we are on our way but a different route... And at the cost of another commercial flight. On a desperate schedule to reach our charter flight that is scheduled. Simon had negotiated a great deal on that and it got me an extra day of hunting on each end of the trip... But it still cost $3200 and I was in danger of having to pay the pilot for an overnight if we were late.. It all works out, barely! The Charter pilot is at the air terminal as we land and ushers me through as quick as possible... Run to the other end of town (ok, not a big town) to clear guns through the Police.. We are finally airborne in the Cessna 206. Land and Simon's guys are there to meet us in two Land Cruisers... We need to drive several hours yet, stopping along the way for various supplies. We finally arrive at camp.. .Then hunting and fixing tires out in the bush... Ice maker is broken so the assistant PH has to make regular runs to town for fresh produce, etc and ice.. oh and beer That's a good 10 hour day, much closer than in the Selous In fact in most or all of the Selous, I'm not sure it is doable without a plane. Then on the way home, I stayed until the last possible day, so had to get back and did so without any hotel stays... 60 hours and 6 flights from the time I got out of bed at camp until I got home to my own bed.

It is just not the same as hunting in South Africa. It is so much more and this is why it is such a tragedy to be looking at possibly losing these areas forever. But I don't think it is fair to think that it could be saved by different pricing schemes. There is just more to it.

I knew it was expensive and time consuming, but never knew of the details involved. Even when I first considered hunting Africa some 28 years ago, Tanzania was the most expensive place in Africa to hunt then based on my magazines and when I first started going to DSC. The type of hunting you described I know I will never see do to the expense. And at my age, I am not sure I would want have a go at what you described even if money was not an issue. 25 years ago though, I would have probably jumped right in though! You are correct though that I do not/did not understand the realities of hunting in a place like you described. Maybe in the next life!!!
Thanks

 

[Ridgewalker]

ActionBob, that was some experience! I’d be totally exhausted for weeks after that!
Dragan N, I had no idea the US was 70-80% of hunters. Thanks for that bit of clarification.
At $50-100k for a hunt, it’s sadly beyond my means.

Still a very sad situation.

 

[Catchaser]

Sad to see this.

 

[Shootist43]

So sad to see that yet once again that wildlife will suffer because of actions taken by the acts of the US FWS. They need to be limited to actions involving species native to the United States.

 

[edward]

So sad to see that yet once again that wildlife will suffer because of actions taken by the acts of the US FWS. They need to be limited to actions involving species native to the United States.

HEAR,HEAR.

 

[cmnhunt]

Brickburn, I understand the outfitter is going out of business because he can't sell any (or enough) 21 day lion or elephant hunts to pay the bills, primarily because Americans can't bring home the trophies.
But, I have looked up plains game hunts in the past in most all the African hunting countries...and a simple PG hunt in Tanzania was far to expensive for someone like me to ever hunt there. If I remember correctly fees and taxes from the government go on and on. Not to mention I believe you are required to have a 10 day hunt for an impala or 16 days for a kudu. So do you not think this is part of their problem also, just too expensive for most of us on the most simple level? Or am I missing something here?

Seriously,
I'll be cynical. How has it even considered a "shame on you US "for letting this happen? Most people that want to hunt in Africa, want to go to a wild place. Not a 100 acre enclosure that's stuffed with put and take animals. We would love to go and hunt Tanzania but unfortunately don't have an extra 50000 dollars laying around each year to take mum and the kids on a shoot for Tommys and Grants. Stop pricing yourselves out of the market!

 

[Tokoloshe Safaris]

David, I know you so I'm pretty sure I can be a bit direct with you and you will be understanding... But I direct this to several others on this thread as well.

I fear you are missing some of realities of hunting in a place like this. Yes the government fees are high.... Probably worse is the un-reliability and how they may at the drop of a hat change the fees and/or tack on huge surcharges last minute... After the seasons booking are made. However I had heard that the Outfitters had been able to get the ear of those officials and bring some reality back into it. I do not see this as a large contributor to this downfall.

To further address your questions, there have been some seriously good deals offered as Outfitters have gotten more creative in their marketing. Especially for Buffalo and leopard as they strive to stay in business with lions and elephants on the menu. I think lion was the straw that broke the backs... Elephant surely hurt but elephant had been poached so relentlessly that there were really not good hunt-able populations left in many areas. In fact I believe Tanzania herself was trying to conserve the big bulls best she could with resources available... For example, I believe they would not allow a foreign hunter to receive a permit to hunt an elephant unless he had an import permit to take the trophies home. Thus conserving those valuable bulls for more high priced hunts to clients who can import them... Unlike Zimbabwe which has so many elephants they need hunting of them irregardless of what they sell for. And one more thing on elephant, I spoke to several Outfitters who operate there and they actually did not want to hunt elephants as they wished to rebuild populations... We must respect those outfitters for spending what they did and still do on anti poaching to protect animals they do not immediately benefit from.

I digress though, back to the PG hunts. Have you looked at the cost of getting there? And have you looked at the trophy fees for PG? They are really very reasonable once you have your licence and are there! However please try to realize the logistics required to support you hunting out that far from any civilization. And look into the travel expense to get there.

I have looked into it. On a per head basis, a 21 day hunt in Tanzania is really one of the better buys in Africa! The problem is it costs a large amount all at once. And many of us choose to go more places and do smaller hunts more often.... Hunting Tanzania is not in the Bill of Rights. In fact in the United States of America, we are guaranteed the right to "the pursuit of happiness". We are not guaranteed to attain it.

So I've never made it there, but let me give you some real life examples of my trip to Mozambique to hunt with Simon @Traditional Mozambique Safaris. I think it gave me some insight as to what it takes to get to those remote areas..... Fly to Joberg, overnight... Same as you might do to go hunt with an outfit like @Pawprint Safaris ,as you have done. But then you need a visa for Moz. In my case that required not one but two trips to the Conciliate. Ok, back to the airport... Flight was cancelled, another overnight while behind the scenes Simon is working to find another flight. Next morning we are on our way but a different route... And at the cost of another commercial flight. On a desperate schedule to reach our charter flight that is scheduled. Simon had negotiated a great deal on that and it got me an extra day of hunting on each end of the trip... But it still cost $3200 and I was in danger of having to pay the pilot for an overnight if we were late.. It all works out, barely! The Charter pilot is at the air terminal as we land and ushers me through as quick as possible... Run to the other end of town (ok, not a big town) to clear guns through the Police.. We are finally airborne in the Cessna 206. Land and Simon's guys are there to meet us in two Land Cruisers... We need to drive several hours yet, stopping along the way for various supplies. We finally arrive at camp.. .Then hunting and fixing tires out in the bush... Ice maker is broken so the assistant PH has to make regular runs to town for fresh produce, etc and ice.. oh and beer That's a good 10 hour day, much closer than in the Selous In fact in most or all of the Selous, I'm not sure it is doable without a plane. Then on the way home, I stayed until the last possible day, so had to get back and did so without any hotel stays... 60 hours and 6 flights from the time I got out of bed at camp until I got home to my own bed.

It is just not the same as hunting in South Africa. It is so much more and this is why it is such a tragedy to be looking at possibly losing these areas forever. But I don't think it is fair to think that it could be saved by different pricing schemes. There is just more to it.

Well written YOU seem to understand the problem facing not only the hunter, but the problems facing the safari operators and his employees.

 

[ActionBob]

Seriously,
I'll be cynical. How has it even considered a "shame on you US "for letting this happen? Most people that want to hunt in Africa, want to go to a wild place. Not a 100 acre enclosure that's stuffed with put and take animals. We would love to go and hunt Tanzania but unfortunately don't have an extra 50000 dollars laying around each year to take mum and the kids on a shoot for Tommys and Grants. Stop pricing yourselves out of the market!

There are some great deals to be had in some wild places...

https://www.africahunting.com/threa...pecial-offer-for-africahunting-members.35416/

A quick look at other places on the internet... A Moz buff hunt for 8350 Euros, buff and a couple PG 9950 Euros.

There are some deals in some wild places.

 

[MartyJ]

The hard reality is that slowly but surely Africa is going to fade into history books.
Though Zimbabwe is trying to get the old landowners back, it will take a very long time before things return to what it was (if ever).
South Africa is determined to destroy itself. With their parliament voting to confiscate white owned farms/property, it doesn't take a brain surgeon to see what the outcome will be.
It is a sad state of affairs when corruption overrides intelligence and conservation is dictated by emotion and the ballot box (grizzly hunting in British Columbia)
Ron White said it "You can't fix stupid".

 

[cmnhunt]

There are some great deals to be had in some wild places...

https://www.africahunting.com/threa...pecial-offer-for-africahunting-members.35416/

A quick look at other places on the internet... A Moz buff hunt for 8350 Euros, buff and a couple PG 9950 Euros.

There are some deals in some wild places.

True, but Tanzania isn't one of them. When looking for Moz buff hunts, 8350 would be considered a good price, but i have yet to find a hunt in Africa for buff, wild or not as wild, that would end at 8350 euro. Moz has its own gouging going on with increased prices for licenses and trophy fees. Not to mention the little crap that ticks people off like hiring a game scout to tag a long( like in Zim), transfers etc. No price is all inclusive as there are always other things that come up. My point is that Tanzania has been on one side of a spectrum for the African hunting industry. Tanzania caters to the ultra rich or those with much more expendable money than I or the averages like me. They pretty much have not made any accommodations to average working class Americans as plains game hunts have been absolutely ridiculous for prices as well( which is what most people start off with in Africa). South Africa on the other hand has seen a market with working class Americans and has gone with it. South Africa caters to everybody but by far has the most affordable hunts and so working class hunters go where the deals are. South Africa has everything from low fence, no fence and high fence. They also work with people more to make the hunt user friendly and they go out of their way to give a person the best hunting trophy and experience with out adding on multiple fees.

 

[sierraone]

As someone said before, particularly you young guys, go as soon as you can. I am old enough that most if not all of the corruption and many other problems facing hunting in Africa are not going to affect me. So you young guys save some money and get started!