Still worth buying a 338 WinMag if I own a 375?

[CoElkHunter]

I keep hearing that the 338 and even some 300WM actually kicks harder than the 375s. I'm guessing that comes down to rifle weight and stock design.

And the fact that those 2 magnums recoil back at greater speeds than the 375.

it still seems backwards to me.

My Browning A Bolt .338WM has a “sharper” felt recoil than my CZ 550 .375 H&H. However, the Browning scoped weighs 8.5lbs versus the unscoped CZ at 9.3lbs. For my elk hunting in the mountains, I’ll use the Browning.

 

[Jim Golden]

I keep hearing that the 338 and even some 300WM actually kicks harder than the 375s. I'm guessing that comes down to rifle weight and stock design.

And the fact that those 2 magnums recoil back at greater speeds than the 375.

it still seems backwards to me.

Northern Shooter, I think you are correct. The Model 700 has a fairly trim stock, and my scope has about zero eye relief. It's probably as old as I am. With a modern Leupold or something with 4" of eye relief, it'd probably be no problem. It's also about 3.5 pounds lighter than my Enfield. The A-Square Hannibal stock looks like a boat paddle...it won't win any beauty contests. But, the butt is so large that it covers your entire shoulder. If you watch slow motion video of me shooting it, you'll see that it moves the entire upper body....not just the shoulder. The distance from eye to scope never changes under recoil. Art Alphin really figured it out with that design. Again, it's not elegant looking...but it works really well. I'm now building a .458 Lott on the same action (Winchester M1917 Enfield) with the same stock (MPI replica of A-Square Hannibal). Haven't decided if I'll scope it yet....will shoot it with iron sights first and see. Actually chambering it to take a .458 Watts...which as I understand it most commercial reamers for .458 Lott are actually the Watts. The only real difference is the Watts used the full 2.85" case whereas Lott shortened it to 2.80" for some reason. I use Hornady Basic Belted Magnum brass which is the full 2.85". But you can also buy (fairly inexpensively) proper head stamped .458 Lott brass from Hornady...about $80/50. To take to Africa. All this being said, I like the ballistics of the .338-.378 Weatherby. It's even hotter than the .338 Lapua. Build one of those with a 30" barrel and really reach out

 

[colorado]

I have a Rem XCR II that i had rechamberd from 375 H&H to 375 Weatherby. It weighs 7 1/2 lbs with scope unloaded. Shoots 300g A-Frames at 2800 fps. Because of that I have no need for a 338 WM. If all I had was a 375 H&H i might, but then again I probably would just calculate my holdover.

 

[Dr Ray]

Suggest using 225 grain bullets in 338

 

[Bonk]

If you're looking for a medium long range, hard hitting, low recoiling caliber suitable for everything from whitetails to large African plains game may I suggest the venerable 9.3x62.

286gr Partition
3500ftlbs at 2350fps
SD .305
BC .482
-10" @ 300 yards
Low recoil
Standard action
115 years of legacy, class and panache

That's a standard load and you can load up or down to create the perfect load to hunt your favorite critter.

I have 7mm rifles, .30 cal rifles (std and mag), .366/375 cal rifles and one .400+ cal rifle. There isn't a caliber gap anywhere in that inventory but the idea of a 338WM still intrigues me. I know it won't do anything one of my other rifles can't do but it still piques my interest..

Back to the OP's question. Yes, buy a 338. It's a great caliber. That's it. No other justification needed. Who cares about redundancy, overlap or necessity. A great rifle in a great caliber is one of life's little enjoyments. If the bills are paid, savings are funded and there's a little leftover go ahead and treat yourself. Life's too short. Enjoy it while you can.

 

[Bonk]

Talk about timing. I was perusing a favorite LGS on-line inventory last night and they have a Sako 85 Classic in 338WM. $2100. Coincidence? I'm taking it as a sign from God.

I'm not going to buy it but if anyone else is interested I'll send you a link. They'll ship.

 

[HankBuck]

I've lately been drawn to the 338WM as a more long range option for taking elk-sized game. I already own a 375H&H, is the 338WM unique enough to own as well?

it looks like the 375 produces about 10% more muzzle energy and while a flat shooter, is outperformed by the 338s higher BCs the further you reach out.

would you pick up a rifle in 338WM if you currently owned a 375?

Why? Tell us anything the Whelen does better than the .338WM.

I don’t think anyone could claim that a .35 Whelen matches a .338wm “ballistically” - by any actual measurement the .338wm would appear superior. My point would be that for shooting targets - .338wm has a clear advantage but in actual Hunting and killing Elk the difference between the two is much less. Either has more then enough power to cleanly kill Elk out to 300 and even 400 yrd. and most Hunters can Not consistently make good shots past 300 yards in actual hunting situations. In favor of the .338wm are superior ballistics, in favor of the .35 Whelen is “everything else” ie: Less recoil, bigger hole, plenty of power. 35 Whelen would be “as effective” killing an Elk as a .338wm out to 300 yrds. Note “effective” does not mean equal ballistically, bullet placement is by far the most important consideration - a .243 in the lungs beats a .416 mag thru the guts everytime. I’ve read that for the “average Hunter” a .30-06 is about as much recoil they can handle without shooting accuracy being affected (flinch). Another interesting article I read was that in the 1930s the .30-06 was one of the FIVE most popular calibers used the hunt Elk and in the 1990s it was still one of the FIVE most popular calibers used for Elk...the big difference was that in the 1930’s it was the MOST POWERFULL caliber used and in the 1990s it was LEAST powerful. The Elk haven’t changed but hunters perceptions have - reading magazines & marketing have convinced some modern hunters that we “need” a magnum. I don’t disagree that most magnums are superior ballistically but maybe they aren’t always needed and many Hunters would shoot better with a lighter kicking rifle. Just my opinion and I’m No expert, while I tend to hunt with more traditional calibers - I certainly enjoy modern optics, rangefinders, and other helpful inventions of the last 30 years. I also have hunted with a .470NE and .375 H&H so I’m aware powerful rifles add value to certain hunting situations.

 

[Flewis]

@Deepfork
Means class and style.
Bob

Again Bob you left out cool.

 

[HankBuck]

I’m a huge fan of the .338 Win mag. I’ve used it to hammer three elk and few deer. I’ve owed a .340 Wby #1 which I wish I still had. My new favorite .338 is the RUM.
I’m going to stir some S..T here: Although I’ve used .308, 30/06 and .300 Wby with great success. in general, if I don’t think the .270 Win / .280 Rem is enough, I usually skip over the .30’s and grab a .338.
IMO, where you aren’t hunting one or two species like in NA, and are hunting wide variety of game that includes DG (Africa), then a .375 is the go to.

My question, and not being antagonistic, what animals have you taken with your .338WM that would not be just-as-dead if hit with .30-06 (hit in same place, with properly matched bullet)? First list those taken at 500 yrds and under — but then add those over 500 yrds. I understand that the drop allowance might need to be more - but if you put the bullet in the vitals - would they still be dead? To be fair - I don’t own and have never taken game with .338 and admitt that “on paper” the ballistics of a .338 are superior to .30-06. Just comparing to the majority of real life/hunting situations. My guess (and it’s an unsubstantiated guess) is that 90%-95% could’ve been taken with a .30-06. Lastly, I admitt that I don’t think I could be as accurate with a .338wm as I can with .30-06 because the softer recoil of the ‘06 keeps me very relaxed and comfortable during the trigger squeeze. Appreciate your thoughts?

 

[cash_tx]

If the walnut is pretty enough, it's always worth buying another (of any caliber). ;-)

 

[HankBuck]

If the walnut is pretty enough, it's always worth buying another (of any caliber). ;-)

AGREE !!! Pretty wood is like a pretty Woman...doesn’t matter if she can cook or has her MBA

 

[Tintin]

"half steps" of overlap from one cartridge to the next

So now I have 'half gaps' as well as calibre gaps I need to fill

That concept is going to cost me money

 

[meigsbucks]

My question, and not being antagonistic, what animals have you taken with your .338WM that would not be just-as-dead if hit with .30-06 (hit in same place, with properly matched bullet)? First list those taken at 500 yrds and under — but then add those over 500 yrds. I understand that the drop allowance might need to be more - but if you put the bullet in the vitals - would they still be dead? To be fair - I don’t own and have never taken game with .338 and admitt that “on paper” the ballistics of a .338 are superior to .30-06. Just comparing to the majority of real life/hunting situations. My guess (and it’s an unsubstantiated guess) is that 90%-95% could’ve been taken with a .30-06. Lastly, I admitt that I don’t think I could be as accurate with a .338wm as I can with .30-06 because the softer recoil of the ‘06 keeps me very relaxed and comfortable during the trigger squeeze. Appreciate your thoughts?
[/QUOTE
First I wouldn’t shoot past 500yds. Dead…. yes. I shot my first elk at 20yds with a .30/06. It went about 100yds, staggered out of the herd and then ran another 50yds. Lungs obliterated. Of the elk I’ve shot with .338 Win mag and .375 H&H, none traveled more than 30 yds.
I shot a zebra with the .30/06 that went about 150yds. The one shot with the .338 RUM only took a few steps.

 

[Rare Breed]

I've lately been drawn to the 338WM as a more long range option for taking elk-sized game. I already own a 375H&H, is the 338WM unique enough to own as well?

it looks like the 375 produces about 10% more muzzle energy and while a flat shooter, is outperformed by the 338s higher BCs the further you reach out.

would you pick up a rifle in 338WM if you currently owned a 375?

I owned a Sako 338 which was a great rifle. At the end of the day I sold it given my needs are covered with a 30-06, 275 Rigby, 375 H&H and a 470 NE. However let’s not think of need but rather wants. Get what you want and forget about need

 

[rookhawk]

Nope.

I've lately been drawn to the 338WM as a more long range option for taking elk-sized game. I already own a 375H&H, is the 338WM unique enough to own as well?

it looks like the 375 produces about 10% more muzzle energy and while a flat shooter, is outperformed by the 338s higher BCs the further you reach out.

would you pick up a rifle in 338WM if you currently owned a 375?

While very few people do handloads with lighter 375HH ammo, there are 235gr, 250gr, and 260gr loads that are flat shooting and suitable for elk.

I would always advise people that contemplate africa in their future to spend 2-3x as much and buy ONE very exceptional 375HH to use for NA and Africa rather than a bunch of shoddy guns in all the calibers.

 

[Rare Breed]

Nope.


While very few people do handloads with lighter 375HH ammo, there are 235gr, 250gr, and 260gr loads that are flat shooting and suitable for elk.

I would always advise people that contemplate africa in their future to spend 2-3x as much and buy ONE very exceptional 375HH to use for NA and Africa rather than a bunch of shoddy guns in all the calibers.

Agree. I spent $6k for a beautiful custom Mauser in 375 H&H which was an incredible deal for the rifle which was worth much more

 

[HankBuck]

Nope.


While very few people do handloads with lighter 375HH ammo, there are 235gr, 250gr, and 260gr loads that are flat shooting and suitable for elk.

I would always advise people that contemplate africa in their future to spend 2-3x as much and buy ONE very exceptional 375HH to use for NA and Africa rather than a bunch of shoddy guns in all the calibers.

Nope.


While very few people do handloads with lighter 375HH ammo, there are 235gr, 250gr, and 260gr loads that are flat shooting and suitable for elk.

I would always advise people that contemplate africa in their future to spend 2-3x would you as much and buy ONE very exceptional 375HH to use for NA and Africa rather than a bunch of shoddy guns in all the calibers.

Would you agree that with a .30-06 & a .375 H&H you are adequately covered for all big game (except Elephant) on both NA and Africa? Not that having extra rifles in many other calibers is ever wrong

 

[rookhawk]

Would you agree that with a .30-06 & a .375 H&H you are adequately covered for all big game (except Elephant) on both NA and Africa? Not that having extra rifles in many other calibers is ever wrong

I’m not a 30 cal guy, so trying to carve away my biases. Probably the honest answer is yes.

If you had a 6.5x55 or a 7x57 AND a 375HH you’d be the coolest kid on my street, ready for about everything on the planet.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I’m not a 30 cal guy, so trying to carve away my biases. Probably the honest answer is yes.

If you had a 6.5x55 or a 7x57 AND a 375HH you’d be the coolest kid on my street, ready for about everything on the planet.

@ rookhawk
I'm the same. Don't see the need for a 30 cal. Where my 25 finishes the 35 takes over. If'n it need more than a good 35 it will be to big to fit my frying pan.
Bob

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

I don’t think anyone could claim that a .35 Whelen matches a .338wm “ballistically” - by any actual measurement the .338wm would appear superior. My point would be that for shooting targets - .338wm has a clear advantage but in actual Hunting and killing Elk the difference between the two is much less. Either has more then enough power to cleanly kill Elk out to 300 and even 400 yrd. and most Hunters can Not consistently make good shots past 300 yards in actual hunting situations. In favor of the .338wm are superior ballistics, in favor of the .35 Whelen is “everything else” ie: Less recoil, bigger hole, plenty of power. 35 Whelen would be “as effective” killing an Elk as a .338wm out to 300 yrds. Note “effective” does not mean equal ballistically, bullet placement is by far the most important consideration - a .243 in the lungs beats a .416 mag thru the guts everytime. I’ve read that for the “average Hunter” a .30-06 is about as much recoil they can handle without shooting accuracy being affected (flinch). Another interesting article I read was that in the 1930s the .30-06 was one of the FIVE most popular calibers used the hunt Elk and in the 1990s it was still one of the FIVE most popular calibers used for Elk...the big difference was that in the 1930’s it was the MOST POWERFULL caliber used and in the 1990s it was LEAST powerful. The Elk haven’t changed but hunters perceptions have - reading magazines & marketing have convinced some modern hunters that we “need” a magnum. I don’t disagree that most magnums are superior ballistically but maybe they aren’t always needed and many Hunters would shoot better with a lighter kicking rifle. Just my opinion and I’m No expert, while I tend to hunt with more traditional calibers - I certainly enjoy modern optics, rangefinders, and other helpful inventions of the last 30 years. I also have hunted with a .470NE and .375 H&H so I’m aware powerful rifles add value to certain hunting situations.

@HankBuck
What will the 338WM do that the Whelen won't do balisticly?
A 225gn accubond at 2,900fps out of the Whelen ain't no slouch.
Nor is a 250gn speer hot core or nosler partition at 2,700fps.
Now how bout a 275gn Woodleigh or a 280gn swift AFrame at over 2,500fps is serious hurt.
Throw in a 310gn 35 cal at 2,455fps with the same sd as a 350gn .375 cal projectiles and you have some serious penetration.
Plus you can keep your hat on you heed when y'all pull the trigger and not get slapped silly by that vicious little bitch slapping little 338.
But hey what would I know I am biased.
Bob