TSS ammo...is it worth it?

[sureshot375]

Update with results:

I just got back from South Dakota. We add 3 day of fairly informal duck hunting onto our annual pheasant hunt when we get drawn for permits. We a pass shooting ducks and geese on small sloughs in the middle of ag fields. No decoys. It’s rather challenging shooting.

I was shooting Apex ammo 3” TSS(not a blend) 1oz advertised at 1550 fps #8s.

This stuff works. I am completely sold. There is a noticeable difference in how hard ththings hit. Birds folded and hit the water stone dead. No having to chase cripple or shoot wounded birds on the water.

I also had more doubles and triples than ever before. The birds fold up so decisively, that you can immediately more on to the next bird.

My 2 hunting companions both shot traditional steel. I brought down more birds every day of the hunt. On one occasion I sat next to one of my friends, the side by side comparison was noticeable.

I did not have a major problem with bloodshot meat.

The shells are expensive, but when you look at my costs for the hunt: time of work(the most expensive cost), travel, lodging, etc; adding $250 for shells is minimal.

I did take a box of cheaper shells to shoot cripples and such, but I never had to shoot one of my own cripples.

 

[BeeMaa]

Update with results:

I just got back from South Dakota. We add 3 day of fairly informal duck hunting onto our annual pheasant hunt when we get drawn for permits. We a pass shooting ducks and geese on small sloughs in the middle of ag fields. No decoys. It’s rather challenging shooting.

I was shooting Apex ammo 3” TSS(not a blend) 1oz advertised at 1550 fps #8s.

This stuff works. I am completely sold. There is a noticeable difference in how hard ththings hit. Birds folded and hit the water stone dead. No having to chase cripple or shoot wounded birds on the water.

I also had more doubles and triples than ever before. The birds fold up so decisively, that you can immediately more on to the next bird.

My 2 hunting companions both shot traditional steel. I brought down more birds every day of the hunt. On one occasion I sat next to one of my friends, the side by side comparison was noticeable.

I did not have a major problem with bloodshot meat.

The shells are expensive, but when you look at my costs for the hunt: time of work(the most expensive cost), travel, lodging, etc; adding $250 for shells is minimal.

I did take a box of cheaper shells to shoot cripples and such, but I never had to shoot one of my own cripples.

These are the same results my friend is seeing while hunting ducks in NY...folding and falling from the sky. Congratulations on a successful hunt. Here's a picture of him with a beautiful Wood Duck...

 

[BeeMaa]

For those who are interested in Federal Black Cloud TSS 3&9 for waterfowl, Rogers Sporting Goods is running a sale when you buy a case...brings the price per shell down to $2.70. Hard to beat that kind of deal...
https://www.rogerssportinggoods.com...e=3%20%26%209&custcolboxandcasematrixoption=4

 

[steve white]

Like many, I hunt all kinds of birds with my shotguns. Up until recently I've been using lead or copper coated lead for everything except waterfowling. Since 1991 waterfowling has required nontoxic shot and for a long time this has meant steel. Steel being less dense than lead required the hunters to go up two shot sizes to get the punch needed on waterfowl vs what they were using before. This forced the shotgun manufacturers & ammo companies to come up with 3.5" shells so they could pack enough payload of (steel) shot to get the humane kills on waterfowl. Now they have developed a new TSS (Tungsten Super Shot) that has a density of 18 g/cc. For reference lead is 11 g/cc and steel is 7.8 g/cc. Obviously TSS is better and I've heard and seen (on YouTube) that people are poleaxing waterfowl & turkey out to incredible ranges.

That leads me to this weekend. A few friends and I head to a house in the country for a few days on our own. I brought Hevi-Shot 3.5" BB and BBB, Federal TSS 7 shot and Hevi-Shot Magnum Blend 5/6/7 shot. All were being shot out of my Benelli Super Black Eagle 2 using Carlson's chokes.

Federal TSS 7 is my #1 pick costing about $10 per shell. They do the job out beyond 60 and possibly 70 yards for EVERYTHING. Goose, duck, turkey...doesn't matter this stuff is gonna kill any bird you can see out beyond 60 yards. Devastating results that I never suspected. I've just ordered a bunch of this for our ammo locker. I would have shot a couple more of these but my shoulder couldn't take it. Felt like I was shooting a 460WBY without a brake.

Hevi-Shot Magnum Blend 5/6/7 is good but not better than TSS costing $8 per shell. Way better than steel but didn't pattern for me as well as the TSS. I'll use what I have left for waterfowling out to 50 or so yards but not for turkey.

Hevi-Shot BB & BBB cost $1.50 per shell - I didn't save the patterns for the Hevi-Shot loads because they were fine at 30 yards, but anything beyond that was garbage. I'll use what I have left in the event I need a finishing shot on a wounded duck or goose. Anyone looking for this ammo, send me a PM and I'll sell it to you.

Patterns speak for themselves.
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So, much better than even hardened lead...

 

[steve white]

I've used it while shooting black brant with my Model 21. Better than lead but pricey.

Doesn't small shot size mitigate much of the risk?

 

[Mekaniks]

For those who are interested in Federal Black Cloud TSS 3&9 for waterfowl, Rogers Sporting Goods is running a sale when you buy a case...brings the price per shell down to $2.70. Hard to beat that kind of deal...
https://www.rogerssportinggoods.com/federal-blackcloudt-ss-waterfowl-12gauge-3inch?quantity=1&shot_size=3%20%26%209&custcolboxandcasematrixoption=4

Thanks for that @BeeMaa . I just ordered a case. That’s by far the best price I have seen.

 

[Nevada Mike]

Doesn't small shot size mitigate much of the risk?

Yes, I think it does... more retained energy. I have a friend that uses tungsten #9 shot for a lot of upland shooting - including pheasants.

 

[BeeMaa]

Yes, I think it does... more retained energy. I have a friend that uses tungsten #9 shot for a lot of upland shooting - including pheasants.

The ammo from Apex is really good from what I hear, but as of yet I've not tried it. Seems like they are out of stock a lot.

 

[BeeMaa]

Got a text from my friend (IGS) this morning. He's decoy/calling ducks from a blind on a lake in NY with two other guys. Three ducks landed on the outer edge of the decoys at about 70 yards and started to swim towards the blind. IGS reaches down and changes to his TKY choke and loads a Federal TSS Heavyweight 2 1/4 oz load of #7. The ducks have circled a little bit and the distance is now 60 yards. All three heads of the ducks line up...BAM. Three ducks in the bag.

I'll see what I can do about getting a picture of the ducks. For now all I have is a picture of the set up.

 

[Longdrive]

I’ve been thinking about trying it with the 410. Sounds like it’s worth a shot.

 

[BeeMaa]

I’ve been thinking about trying it with the 410. Sounds like it’s worth a shot.

I've heard good things about the Federal Heavyweight TSS turkey load in .410 caliber, but I've never tried it. Maybe you can share a picture of a 30 and 40 yard pattern.

 

[BWH]

I use Boss exclusively for waterfowl…. The TSS is great for turkey ….. just pricey! However, if you are spending money on a hunt…, what’s another $20 for proper ammo

 

[Philip Glass]

I love to hunt waterfowl but rarely ever get to. Since I hunt so seldom I dont care what it costs I want the best. I am thankful for these informative posts. Maybe I can get some shells bought before the next opportunity to hunt comes around.

 

[BeeMaa]

I love to hunt waterfowl but rarely ever get to. Since I hunt so seldom I dont care what it costs I want the best. I am thankful for these informative posts. Maybe I can get some shells bought before the next opportunity to hunt comes around.

Rogers Sporting Goods is running a sale on a case Federal Black Cloud TSS 3&9 for $269 and free shipping. Prime load for duck, but a little light for goose.
https://www.rogerssportinggoods.com...e=3%20%26%209&custcolboxandcasematrixoption=4

 

[BeeMaa]

I just ordered (split it with IGS) some Apex TSS waterfowl ammo, 12 bore 1 oz #9's at 1550 fps. Should be here by Saturday and then maybe some pattern testing will be in order.

I would have ordered some 7.5's as well, but they stopped production to ramp up for turkey season.

 

[flatwater bill]

Federal Black Cloud 3/9 is a lot better price wise......40% of the load, by weight, is #3 steel, so sounds like a good compromise between price and performance. Although I have written on this website about how impressed I am with Apex ammo, they are still not for me while duck hunting. Stopping a large carnivore? Ya, that's where I'd use them. I priced TSS last week at $14.20 per round (although some loads are more). With 6% sales tax, that's $45.16 for 3 shots. Ever shoot 3 shots at a duck? I have. In the days before most current hunters were born, there were 70 yard shotgun loads. And I used them. And I learned that my harvest was improved more by practice, better decoy spreads, and better calling, than the occasional bird I could hit at very long range. But these things apply to me, and your wallet and hunting situation may be different. As I also mentioned before, nothing even remotely approached the effectiveness of Apex 2 oz of TSS size T shot in my grizzly stopping tests.....(and no grizzlies were harmed in this film).......................FWB

 

[BeeMaa]

My friend, IGS has returned from 3 days in Arkansas for duck and goose hunting with Apex #9 TSS and Federal Black Cloud TSS BB/7. He was hunting from a pit blind with as many as 15 other hunters. Sometimes all of them shooting at the same time.

For the first day, he used the Apex #9 TSS thinking the ducks would be close, they were not. In fact they were in excess of 50 yards and the #9 TSS did not have the desired effect. Half way though day 2 he switched to the Black Cloud TSS BB/7 and everything changed. All of a sudden the birds were falling at the same distances. Of course it's impossible to know with 16 hunters who exactly hit what, but I'd consider IGS a better shot than most. He did remark on two separate occasions when he was the only one who shot and the birds fell like stones. There was no question to the accuracy of the shot or energy of the load.

IGS and the others harvested several kinds of ducks and geese over 3 days of hunting. Here's IGS with a few specs that he is credited with taking beyond the shadow of a doubt.

Keep in mind these are moving targets at 50 yards, but he came back with a definite preference for the Federal Black Cloud TSS BB/7. He said that the Apex #9 TSS would be better suited to early season ducks that are willing to come in closer or hunts with fewer hunters where the birds are closer.

 

[HookMeUpII]

Use it, love it, probably will never use anything else unless something better comes out. I shoot Boss bismuth and their TSS loads for turkey. Waterfowl hunting is 90% of my hunting. I usually hunt between 20-30x a year. Bismuth/TSS is a game changer. Birds in the past that you knew you hit, only to have them shudder and fly away, now just drop stone dead. Not to mention I've found #5 bismuth to be more lethal, at a longer range, than even #2 steel.

More pellets
Longer effective range
And more lethal

Takes a little tweaking of the choke selection and shooting but once you get it, dial it in, most people never switch back.

I know of an Arkansas outfitter who drives up to the Boss plant, has them load a palette into his truck or trailer, and goes through it one season. Everything from teal, to mallards, to snow geese, to honkers. It's all he provides his clients.

 

[BWH]

Use it, love it, probably will never use anything else unless something better comes out. I shoot Boss bismuth and their TSS loads for turkey. Waterfowl hunting is 90% of my hunting. I usually hunt between 20-30x a year. Bismuth/TSS is a game changer. Birds in the past that you knew you hit, only to have them shudder and fly away, now just drop stone dead. Not to mention I've found #5 bismuth to be more lethal, at a longer range, than even #2 steel.

More pellets
Longer effective range
And more lethal

Takes a little tweaking of the choke selection and shooting but once you get it, dial it in, most people never switch back.

I know of an Arkansas outfitter who drives up to the Boss plant, has them load a palette into his truck or trailer, and goes through it one season. Everything from teal, to mallards, to snow geese, to honkers. It's all he provides his clients.

I wonder why he would go to the expense to drive all the way up to Stevensville, MI to buy it when they offered free shipping. Now they have bumped it up to $10 on all orders.

 

[HookMeUpII]

For the first day, he used the Apex #9 TSS thinking the ducks would be close, they were not. In fact they were in excess of 50 yards and the #9 TSS did not have the desired effect. Half way though day 2 he switched to the Black Cloud TSS BB/7 and everything changed. All of a sudden the birds were falling at the same distances. Of course it's impossible to know with 16 hunters who exactly hit what, but I'd consider IGS a better shot than most. He did remark on two separate occasions when he was the only one who shot and the birds fell like stones. There was no question to the accuracy of the shot or energy of the load.

Keep in mind these are moving targets at 50 yards, but he came back with a definite preference for the Federal Black Cloud TSS BB/7. He said that the Apex #9 TSS would be better suited to early season ducks that are willing to come in closer or hunts with fewer hunters where the birds are closer.

As I mentioned, I hunt waterfowl mostly. I usually go through a case a year of shells if not more. My only caveat to your comment is 7-9 is really small even for bismuth/TSS. 5-6 is more appropriate. Especially on things like specks and honkers. If I am hunting honkers or snows here, I typically switch out the #5 for #4's. Considering that most guys were shooting #2-#4 steel most of the time, #5-#6 bismuth/TSS, at the same or better lethality, is a huge improvement. I keep a couple boxes of #3 bismuth which are absolute hammers if we are dealing with really difficult snows or honkers.

#7-#9 I feel would be more suited to smaller ducks like teal in close. Even then, I never switch out #5's.

These two black ducks fell to #5 Boss. The first one I nailed at 30-40 yds. Very unlike black ducks, the second came back around. I actually was standing up in the boat, pulling my anchor sticks. I picked the gun up as he flew past at about 15-20 yds. Boom. Two pieces parted mid air. I said to myself "Hmm what the hell happened." I ended up retrieving the head and the body.