USA: Boulder Creek Outfitters Of Idaho

[IdaRam]

LOL I see you met Timmy. Sorry to say, but that's not abnormal behavior for him. My best friend guided one season (because that was enough of that) for him about 15 or so years ago. Also, IOGA is a damn joke. By joke, I mean crooked as Highway 12. You want to see what those folks are made of, just do some checking into the incident involving Tim Craig, IOGA, FAG (Idaho Fish & Game), USFWS, and Warm Springs Outfitters (Gordon Frost). I'll give you the ending to that story: Gordon went to prison and IOGA awarded Gordon's area to Tim. All that being said, Tim's son, Matt, is a pretty good guy; I figured that Tim would have handed over operations to Matt by now.

What did Gordon go to prison for? And obviously there was a court involved there as well…

 

[IdaRam]

A bit of additional information may also be helpful here. Particularly for anyone considering hunting with an outfitter in Idaho.

IOGA (Idaho Outfitters and Guides Association) is an organization OF the outfitters and guides FOR the outfitters and guides BY the outfitters and guides.

Principles and Mission

ioga.org

IOGLB (Idaho Outfitters & Guides Licensing Board) is an entity within IDF&G (Idaho Fish and Game) which licenses and regulates Outfitters and Guides and allocates areas for exclusive outfitting privileges by species.

Licensing - Idaho Outfitters and Guides Licensing Board

idfg.idaho.gov

Outfitting on National Forest land requires a permit from the USFS

Complaints against Outfitters and Guides may be lodged with any of these entities.

Violations of state or federal law may be reported to IDF&G and the appropriate County Sheriff

 

[Ontario Hunter]

In Montana last I knew the East Side ranchers were legally able to run outfitting business without being licensed. The guys outfitting on USFS land must have federal use permit (mega $$$!) AND a state license.

Thanks for broadcasting this incident on the net. Might save others from walking into a similar jackpot with this outfitter. Your tips were generous enough. I probably would have stiffed the guide for trying to leave two elderly clients to dress their own elk. Let him complain to the outfitter. Any reputable outfitter would send a guide down the road for that. Imagine if one of you had a heart attack dressing an elk. The outfitter would never get insurance again.

 

[R.M.C.]

Guide tried to get you to dress your own elk?!?! Reminds me of a hog hunt a buddy and I went on in south Texas. The guide wanted my friend to change the oil in his truck, even pointing out the new oil and filter and tools lol. My buddy paid him exactly what the three day hunt cost, no tip hahaha.

 

[TheGrayRider]

The outfitters and staff in Africa seem much more appreciative of tips and gratuities than many of the outfitters and staff here in North America. The hunt and camp staffs in Africa also seemed happier overall to me than their North American counterparts.

They own less property and definitely have lower expenses. What is the old saying, “Less is truly more.” Unfortunately, technology will probably ruin them over time.

Happy hunting, TheGrayRider.

 

[WillMFerguson]

What did Gordon go to prison for? And obviously there was a court involved there as well…

Read for yourself. The Spokesman got it wrong on a few things; Gordon went to federal prison, not jail. https://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/jun/09/poaching-has-impact-on-idahoans-illegal-hunting/

There was indeed a court involved. What's your point?

My dad worked for Gordon for a couple of falls after my dad retired. If you want the full story, ask around and form your own conclusions. Looks like you are in ID, so that shouldn't be too hard (unless you are a transplant/fed/or local LE they don't trust, in which case it may take a bit longer for you to get the full story).

 

[IdaRam]

Read for yourself. The Spokesman got it wrong on a few things; Gordon went to federal prison, not jail. https://www.spokesman.com/stories/1997/jun/09/poaching-has-impact-on-idahoans-illegal-hunting/

There was indeed a court involved. What's your point?

My dad worked for Gordon for a couple of falls after my dad retired. If you want the full story, ask around and form your own conclusions. Looks like you are in ID, so that shouldn't be too hard (unless you are a transplant/fed/or local LE they don't trust, in which case it may take a bit longer for you to get the full story).

Oh, OK, thank you. It appears that Gordon went to prison for illegal outfitting operations and Lacey Act violations along with 22 other people being charged, some convicted and fines and probation being handed down.

In your previous post you said IOGA is a damn joke, crooked as highway 12. You went on to say IOGA awarded the area to Tim. IOGA does not award any areas to anybody. The state of Idaho through Idaho Fish & Game and the Outfitters and Guides Licensing Board determine which outfitter has the rights to guiding and outfitting in a particular area.
My comment about a court being involved was an observation that regardless of IOGA, IDFG (or FAG as you referred to them), USFWS, etc. Gordon (and many others) were convicted by a court of law.

Hmmm, no I am not a Fed or local LE and no I don’t care to investigate an illegal act from 30 years ago. Probably time for you to let it go too.

My point, the facts matter and you seem to have yours all mixed up.

 

[Rolly]

Yes, since our experience with BCO I have heard several other experiences regarding Tim , the owner, of BCO. He is a foul mouthed, loose cannon appearing to just wait for someone willing to give him what ,regrettably, may be a violent response to his mouth. By the way he also talked about hunting wolves via helicopter in this hunting area along the Snake and Salmon rivers. He was boasting about it. A real sportsman!

 

[WillMFerguson]

Oh, OK, thank you. It appears that Gordon went to prison for illegal outfitting operations and Lacey Act violations along with 22 other people being charged, some convicted and fines and probation being handed down.

In your previous post you said IOGA is a damn joke, crooked as highway 12. You went on to say IOGA awarded the area to Tim. IOGA does not award any areas to anybody. The state of Idaho through Idaho Fish & Game and the Outfitters and Guides Licensing Board determine which outfitter has the rights to guiding and outfitting in a particular area.
My comment about a court being involved was an observation that regardless of IOGA, IDFG (or FAG as you referred to them), USFWS, etc. Gordon (and many others) were convicted by a court of law.

Hmmm, no I am not a Fed or local LE and no I don’t care to investigate an illegal act from 30 years ago. Probably time for you to let it go too.

My point, the facts matter and you seem to have yours all mixed up.

I'll try to keep this civil, so as not to violate AH's Terms of Use because I generally like this forum. First, thank you for confirming that the Spokesman article was incorrect about the basics of Gordon's conviction.

Second, you contradicted yourself about IOGA and FAG. In one sentence you claim I misstated the process (i.e. IOGA awarded the area to BCO). Your next sentence is contradictory because you then admit that IOGA and FAG make a decision on who outfits a particular area. The reality is that IOGA makes the designation and FAG either approves or disapproves.

Third, you show your ignorance when you say "...convicted by a court of law." How many years (if ever) have you served as a judicial officer in any court? How many criminal (not just fish and wildlife) cases have you prosecuted? How many criminal (not just fish and wildlife) cases have you defended? I can answer (with proof) all of those questions as to my experience. Point being, I bet you have virtually no experience, so don't even start with me. As an aside, I'll decide what I let go and what I don't, your opinion and advice notwithstanding.

Fourth, you say I have my facts mixed up. Like what? I'll save you the trouble of answering by giving you a summary: I have my facts lined up and you haven't the foggiest clue of IOGA, FAG, or likely anything in the state of ID. In fact, your response indicates you really are a transplant.

Finally, I don't care what you do.

 

[Ontario Hunter]

The Spokesman article on Frost was very uninformative. Jail or prison doesn't make a lot of difference to me. He did time behind bars, that's what's important. There were literally scores of people convicted. His was clearly a large scale poaching operation. I lived in that neck of the woods for two years. This did not surprise me.

I know of another outfitter in North Central Montana who's every bit the jerk this Tim fella is. I just cannot believe how he keeps his outfitting business running. Clearly, he has no returning clients. Curious thing is his brother runs a ranch down the road and is the nicest guy in the world. I think what's amazing about this case is Rolly and his crew were consistent returning clientele. Why would the outfitter kiss them off over a couple hundred bucks at most? What an idiot.

 

[IdaRam]

Reading comprehension may not be your strong suit, so try re-reading my last post with the understanding that IOGA and IOGLB are distinctly different entities. I specifically referenced IOGBL, not IOGA.
A pissing match between you and I adds nothing to this gentleman’s thread about his poor experience with BCO.
If you wish to start a new thread about Gordon, Tim, IOGA, etc we could debate the issues there I guess. Personally I see no point.
Yes, courteous discourse is a fundamental principle of AH and why it is such a great site. Best to keep it that way.