Which Elephant Rifle and cartridge?

[FlyGuy]

450 Rigby shooting a 500gr solid

 

[aminkus]

CZ 550 .404 Jeffery with Nikon African Monarch scope

 

[Longwalker]

I've only hunted one elephant so far. If I ever got to hunt another, my "Ideal" would need to be practical and limited to what I have on hand for firearms.
So I'd pick my Merkel 140 AE double rifle chambered in .450-400 3" Nitro Express. Perhaps few experienced elephant hunters would consider it "ideal" but with this relatively mild but quite capable chambering, in a rifle that I know, have some experience with, and like, I feel I could quickly hit what I'm aiming at. It's especially quick, accurate and responsive when fitted with a Burris reflex sight in the Recknagel QD mount. The recoil is manageable, so I don't flinch. That matters more to me than extra power.

 

[wildwilderness]

I've only hunted one elephant so far. If I ever got to hunt another, my "Ideal" would need to be practical and limited to what I have on hand for firearms.
So I'd pick my Merkel 140 AE double rifle chambered in .450-400 3" Nitro

What rifle, cartridge did you take your first Ele with?

 

[Longwalker]

It was a rented Winchester M70 Safari Express, .416 Rem, loaded with Trophy Bonded Sledgehammer solids. Equipped with a 1.5-5x Leupold. Worked OK, but it would fail to feed if three cartridges were placed in the magazine. So it was a "three shooter". That didn't bother me until I had a wounded bull elephant on the ground at spitting distance and an empty rifle in my hands ... that was disconcerting!

 

[Captain Munro]

Heym .89b .470 or Heym Martini mauser ,404J

My choices exactly! I'd take an 89B in 500 and a Martini in 416 as well haha. Inhave no basis on which to qualify these choices save all the books and articles I have read, as well as other media.

 

[Flipper Dude]

That didn't bother me until I had a wounded bull elephant on the ground at spitting distance and an empty rifle in my hands ... that was disconcerting!

Disconcerting………….. Understated, yet apt description.

 

[Khalanyoni Game Ranch]

The calibre choice is alway as debatable as the preferred vehicle brand and best tyre to do offroading....

Being a leathered PH and listening to conversations around the campfires on our safaris, you gather a lot of advice and get to poke a couple of suggestions around and feel the response coming from clients.

Shotplacement is the best choice.....just another opinion , but once you can deliver a very well placed shot with trustworthy bullets, the calibre choice is up to you.

My BRNO .375H&H have proven itself over and over. My Mauser .458Lott is my go to as back-up , but experience and bullet choice cannot be placed on the back burner.

On Elle, a lot can go wrong if your bullet do not have the penetration that is needed. The tusks inside the scull is a major obstruction and the nasal cavity alike.

If you hit the brain with a .375 solid, you will have the trophy on the ground......missing the brain or spine with the biggest rifle , may leave you on a death run or ending up under the tusks or trunk of a wounded Elle.

I use Peregrine VRG3 Bushmaster bullets on all DG hunts with excellent penetration, perfect expansion and proper weight retension.

" HORSES FOR CAUSES " , Budget is also a prominent factor.

In short : Why use the minimum calibre if your life is at stake ? Rather get a rifle that gel with you, not kicking like a mule. A calibre that you can handle and shoot from the sticks and still do a 50-80 yard 5 shot grouping into a 3inch circle. Use good ammo and study the anatomy of your trophy while putting you in every possible position to take a shot...........Your first shot determine the type of funeral in camp.....yours or the Elle's funeral.

The most common mistake on calibre that I have seen, is the biggest, heaviest ass kicking rifle to boost your ego in the gunshop or around the campfire..........We see this so many times , use enough gun, be one with your rifle, use it as your companion and do not let your ego choose your calibre....

 

[TOBY458]

The calibre choice is alway as debatable as the preferred vehicle brand and best tyre to do offroading....

Being a leathered PH and listening to conversations around the campfires on our safaris, you gather a lot of advice and get to poke a couple of suggestions around and feel the response coming from clients.

Shotplacement is the best choice.....just another opinion , but once you can deliver a very well placed shot with trustworthy bullets, the calibre choice is up to you.

My BRNO .375H&H have proven itself over and over. My Mauser .458Lott is my go to as back-up , but experience and bullet choice cannot be placed on the back burner.

On Elle, a lot can go wrong if your bullet do not have the penetration that is needed. The tusks inside the scull is a major obstruction and the nasal cavity alike.

If you hit the brain with a .375 solid, you will have the trophy on the ground......missing the brain or spine with the biggest rifle , may leave you on a death run or ending up under the tusks or trunk of a wounded Elle.

I use Peregrine VRG3 Bushmaster bullets on all DG hunts with excellent penetration, perfect expansion and proper weight retension.

" HORSES FOR CAUSES " , Budget is also a prominent factor.

In short : Why use the minimum calibre if your life is at stake ? Rather get a rifle that gel with you, not kicking like a mule. A calibre that you can handle and shoot from the sticks and still do a 50-80 yard 5 shot grouping into a 3inch circle. Use good ammo and study the anatomy of your trophy while putting you in every possible position to take a shot...........Your first shot determine the type of funeral in camp.....yours or the Elle's funeral.

The most common mistake on calibre that I have seen, is the biggest, heaviest ass kicking rifle to boost your ego in the gunshop or around the campfire..........We see this so many times , use enough gun, be one with your rifle, use it as your companion and do not let your ego choose your calibre....

Makes an awful lot of sense. Shot placement is king in all hunting.

 

[Rare Breed]

Elephant hunting is really the only area where a double offers a real advantage to those who can shoot them well. The ability to have an instant second shot is a big deal.

I’m partial to my Krieghoff in .500/.416 with iron sights. I’m 3 for 3. Two side brains and 1 heart shot after a buddy missed the brain on a side brain.

I like this caliber for 2 reasons. 1: penetration is as good as it gets. 2: recoil is mild and I can get back on target for a second shot fast.

On my last ele I would have probably been better served with a scoped bolt. Shot was about 35 yards and the way it was standing in the shadows it made it hard for me to discern its exact head angle and aiming point with my naked eye. She eventually turned her head sideways which made for easy aiming.

In terms of bullets, is there a bad solid on the market? I have yet to recover. Hornady or Woodleigh.

On my elephant I too had problems picking him up in the shadows. Its amazing an animal that big at 50 yards can be so hard to detect exact placement in the shadows

 

[deewayne2003]

The calibre choice is alway as debatable as the preferred vehicle brand and best tyre to do offroading....

Being a leathered PH and listening to conversations around the campfires on our safaris, you gather a lot of advice and get to poke a couple of suggestions around and feel the response coming from clients.

Shotplacement is the best choice.....just another opinion , but once you can deliver a very well placed shot with trustworthy bullets, the calibre choice is up to you.

My BRNO .375H&H have proven itself over and over. My Mauser .458Lott is my go to as back-up , but experience and bullet choice cannot be placed on the back burner.

On Elle, a lot can go wrong if your bullet do not have the penetration that is needed. The tusks inside the scull is a major obstruction and the nasal cavity alike.

If you hit the brain with a .375 solid, you will have the trophy on the ground......missing the brain or spine with the biggest rifle , may leave you on a death run or ending up under the tusks or trunk of a wounded Elle.

I use Peregrine VRG3 Bushmaster bullets on all DG hunts with excellent penetration, perfect expansion and proper weight retension.

" HORSES FOR CAUSES " , Budget is also a prominent factor.

In short : Why use the minimum calibre if your life is at stake ? Rather get a rifle that gel with you, not kicking like a mule. A calibre that you can handle and shoot from the sticks and still do a 50-80 yard 5 shot grouping into a 3inch circle. Use good ammo and study the anatomy of your trophy while putting you in every possible position to take a shot...........Your first shot determine the type of funeral in camp.....yours or the Elle's funeral.

The most common mistake on calibre that I have seen, is the biggest, heaviest ass kicking rifle to boost your ego in the gunshop or around the campfire..........We see this so many times , use enough gun, be one with your rifle, use it as your companion and do not let your ego choose your calibre....

Well said, with just 1 elephant under my belt I certainly felt confident with a .470ne loaded with Woodleigh Hydros.

However I did fire 200+ rounds through that rifle before taking it to Africa.

 

[Rare Breed]

You could be right.

It's not fair for me to give an inaccurate figure by speculating now (after all these years). The one I shot in Zimbabwe was in 1982 and was particularly heavy (as you can see in my photographs).

Truth be told, I never bothered to have them weighed since I didn't bring them back with me. South Bengal was under martial law at that time and bringing ivory into the country was next to impossible. And I wasn't particularly interested in bringing the ivory back anyway.

But a few years later, when one of my guests (a fellow hunter) saw these photographs... He commented upon how big the tusks were. A conversation between us lead to him declaring that the tusks could weigh as heavily as "More than 150 LB a side". I never gave it more thought than that.

But yes. It's not very ethical for me to speculate. But I don't think the tusks would be under 110 LB (combined). If my white hunter (Mr. Con Van Wyk) is still around... He can shed further insight. He used to live in Bulawayo until the 1990s.
View attachment 602726View attachment 602727View attachment 602728

I don’t care what they weigh still an outstanding bull!!!!

 

[Green Chile]

On my elephant I too had problems picking him up in the shadows. Its amazing an animal that big at 50 yards can be so hard to detect exact placement in the shadows

Definition on an ele in shadow is not easily done. That clarity is important for brain shots.

 

[Rare Breed]

The 458 WM is a cartridge you settle on... It's not usually your first pick.

now @TOBY458 might not agree with you. lol!!!!

 

[Green Chile]

Settling on a 458? That's probably the most used cartridge in Africa by Parks officials and certainly on ele. I wouldn't feel undergunned at all with a 458 on ele. I do feel undergunned with a 375 and prefer 416 and up.

 

[TOBY458]

Settling on a 458? That's probably the most used cartridge in Africa by Parks officials and certainly on ele. I wouldn't feel undergunned at all with a 458 on ele. I do feel undergunned with a 375 and prefer 416 and up.

Now having two complete R8s in both 458 Win Mag and 458 Lott, I’m pretty well resigned to using one of those on my upcoming bull elephant hunt. I won’t feel undergunned with either choice. I’ve yet to fire the Lott, but the Win Mag worked very well on my last buffalo in 2023. Will be using CEB 450gr solids in either rifle that I take.

 

[Green Chile]

That combo is perfect...as you know. Irons or optics? Remind me where you're going and what time of year?

 

[TOBY458]

That combo is perfect...as you know. Irons or optics? Remind me where you're going and what time of year?

Will probably use an RMR for the elephant and maybe buffalo. Will also have a 1-4x20 scope along for the trip as well. Going to Zim in late April

 

[John Telford]

The .375 Holland is not a good choice for frontal shots on Big bulls such as in Botswana. You will not drop your elephant. Anything from .400 up is better. The choice is wide open. Mine would be .404Jeff in a bolt gun . Affordable and not that rough on the shoulder.

 

[John Telford]

Elephant hunting is really the only area where a double offers a real advantage to those who can shoot them well. The ability to have an instant second shot is a big deal.

I’m partial to my Krieghoff in .500/.416 with iron sights. I’m 3 for 3. Two side brains and 1 heart shot after a buddy missed the brain on a side brain.

I like this caliber for 2 reasons. 1: penetration is as good as it gets. 2: recoil is mild and I can get back on target for a second shot fast.

On my last ele I would have probably been better served with a scoped bolt. Shot was about 35 yards and the way it was standing in the shadows it made it hard for me to discern its exact head angle and aiming point with my naked eye. She eventually turned her head sideways which made for easy aiming.

In terms of bullets, is there a bad solid on the market? I have yet to recover. Hornady or Woodleigh.

Was in their shop last week. Must say they do build a good double.
Worth having a look at if doubles are your thing.