Why all the 6.5 Creedmoor Hate?

[ActionBob]

Yes, I got my first Barbie doll when I was 3 years old. She wore a crown. I carried her around everywhere! My mother always had me dressed like I should be on top of a cake and I often wore dresses with a pinafore. Barbie was always in my pinafore pocket.
Ken…well, he was the servant. I only had one Ken doll. All of my Barbies were well educated with careers. Bob and I were chuckling pretty good at this find that I opted not to bring home.

Hi I'm Ken the servant.... AKA Bob

 

[CraigV]

Rifles and ammo in this caliber are one thing I'll never own.....EVER!

I'm sick of nearly every rifle on the rack at Cabela's only available in it.

I'm sick of every rifle at every fund raiser being only in it.

I'm sick of every major retail catalog and website only stocking rifles in it.

I'm sick of walking into every gun store in the Country, and the only center-fire rifle ammo they have in stock is it.

I'm sick of every article in every shooting or hunting magazine glorifying it.

I'm sick of every hunting or shooting show, podcast or radio talk show spending hours on end blabbering about it.

I've never owned or shot one, and I'm already sick of it.

Wow.

You're pretty sick. Maybe Tylenol or some Mydol??

I have to ask, have you ever shot anything in 6.5CM? If not, you're opinion is simply that. I think Hunter Habib said it best. Our parents didn't like our choices, and we don't like the next generations choices. However, without trying it, we are the ignorant ones.

I hesitated a long time before trying the 6.5CM. A very good friend, who has taken more mammals than most recommended it. I tried it, and yup, it works. We've taken (several) wild boar, white tail and yes, elk with this cartridge.

Now, we practice shot placement - aim small, miss small. All of them have been 1 shot drops. We had an instance where the wild boar was a 2 fer. Shot hit the primary, killed it, passed through, and killed the secondary.

I'm really happy that people are interested in shooting this round, and shooting in general. Call it what you want, think about it how you will, but until you actually use it, STFU.

 

[CoElkHunter]

Yes, I got my first Barbie doll when I was 3 years old. She wore a crown. I carried her around everywhere! My mother always had me dressed like I should be on top of a cake and I often wore dresses with a pinafore. Barbie was always in my pinafore pocket.
Ken…well, he was the servant. I only had one Ken doll. All of my Barbies were well educated with careers. Bob and I were chuckling pretty good at this find that I opted not to bring home.

Gina, did you ever have a G.I. Joe "doll"? I never thought about it as a doll, but I had one and it came with accessories like a helmet, different uniforms, a semi auto Creedmoor rifle, boots, canteen, gloves, etc. Then if you got the Jeep for him to ride in, it had its own accessories like a Browning .35 Whelen machine gun on a tripod in the back, big tires, etc. LOL

 

[mdwest]

Hi I'm Ken the servant.... AKA Bob

I literally lol’d…

 

[Just Gina]

Gina, did you ever have a G.I. Joe "doll"? I never thought about it as a doll, but I had one and it came with accessories like a helmet, different uniforms, a semi auto Creedmoor rifle, boots, canteen, gloves, etc. Then if you got the Jeep for him to ride in, it had its own accessories like a Browning .35 Whelen machine gun on a tripod in the back, big tires, etc. LOL

I did not have a GI Joe, sadly. Funny thing, my daughter loved Barbie dolls when she was little also. Her big brother had these action figure dolls called Max Steel or something like that. They were sort of like GI Joe. Well, he had a lot of them and he had a camo jeep and some other military type vehicles. My son is 5 years older than my daughter and he decided he was too old for his action figures and gave the whole lot to his baby sister. Her Barbie dolls had manly men around with cool vehicles. They went camping and hunting and carried all the groceries and shopping bags for the Barbies.

 

[One Day...]

OK, I will finally bite...

I have nothing per se against the 6.5 Creedmoor, it is a good little cartridge in the line of the 6.5x54 Mannlicher Schonauer, 6.5x55 Swedish, 6.5×57 Mauser, 6.5×58 Vergueiro (Portuguese), 6.5x50 Arisaka, 6.5×52 Carcano (Italian), etc. etc. ... all the way to the more modern .260 Rem.

But I live in Arizona, and I have very close relationships with a couple of outfitters in South Africa's Karoo, so here is what I hate about the 6.5 Creedmoor: I hate the cartridge being used for what it was not designed, admittedly though the stupidity of the folks who use it, rather than those who designed it.

Just because the cartridge can punch paper at 500 yards does not mean that it can kill cleanly at 500 yards, especially larger animals, it simply does not carry the killing power at the distance at which it can punch.

Back to mentioning Arizona and South Africa: in my direct experience, the Arizona mountains and the African Karoo, and I am sure many others places, are getting littered with elk and kudus punched by the 6.5 Creedmoor at stupid distances, because it is easy to shoot, but not killed by it. This is nothing short of criminal. There, I said it.

 

[DLSJR]

I’m late to this thread but will just say I have no beef with the cartridge, but do with the idiots who make it out to be some magical round that it simply isn’t.

So many talk about it being a long range elk cartridge…. IT‘S NOT! The only people who think it’s a long range elk cartridge haven’t done a lot of elk hunting. Lose a bull at long range and if you’re honest you admit either you or the cartridge, probably both, are not up to the task. 6.5 Needmore shooters all too often think it’s more than it really is. Here’s an example….

I was talking to a hunter who was expounding upon the virtues of his 6.5 Needmore as a great long range elk cartridge. I said it wasn’t. He asked me to back up my comment and I stated a .264 Win Mag isn’t a long range elk cartridge (I shoot a .264 and it has killed about 1/2 dozen Tule & Roosevelt elk, all shot at reasonable ranges) and if it isn’t a long range elk round (it’s not), a Needmore sure as hell isn’t. He replied “The Creedmore is superior to a .264!” I asked the guy if he knew that a .264 shoots the exact same bullet as a Needmore, but almost 400 fps faster. His response was “Maybe so, but the creedmore is still better”. WTF??? I got brain damage trying to rationalize this idiot’s beliefs.

It’s that complete lack of logic and unrealistic belief in the cartridge as being so much more than it really is by koolaid drinkers that I take issue with. The cartridge is fine for what it was designed to be. It’s the koolaid drinkers who are the problem.

 

[Hunter-Habib]

My thought on the acceptance of the .300 WM is that it fits into a standard length (therefore less expensive) action. The .300 H&H requires a full magnum length action. As more standard length actions are available brass is also easier to come by. As there is more demand for the Win. more loaded ammunition and cases are manufactured to meet demand and availability goes up.
The cost of a magnum Mauser action is the only reason I chose to go with the WM. It also gets about 100 fps more speed than the H&H with 200 grain bullets so I couldn't see a down side.

Yes, Doug. You're 100% right. I completely forgot that the .300 Winchester Magnum can accomplish an extra 100 FPS more than the .300 Holland & Holland Magnum with 200Gr+ bullets. That is a true advantage, especially for those of us who would like to use the heavier bullets out to longer range.

But let's use another example, then. Why is the 7mm-08 Remington so widely accepted when the tried-and-true 7x57mm Mauser can accomplish everything which the 7mm-08 Remington can ?

Okay, I digress. 7mm-08 Remington isn't exactly "Widely Accepted". But it still doesn't garner anywhere as much hatred as the 6.5 Creedmoor.

 

[mauserhunter]

I don't think we should be shooting game over 500 yards which is a freaking long shot hunting, even if you have the power, proper bullet, can hit a clay bird every shot you can't control when that animal shifts its weight and moves almost instantly.

 

[Huntersedge]

Wow.

You're pretty sick. Maybe Tylenol or some Mydol??

I have to ask, have you ever shot anything in 6.5CM? If not, you're opinion is simply that. I think Hunter Habib said it best. Our parents didn't like our choices, and we don't like the next generations choices. However, without trying it, we are the ignorant ones.

I hesitated a long time before trying the 6.5CM. A very good friend, who has taken more mammals than most recommended it. I tried it, and yup, it works. We've taken (several) wild boar, white tail and yes, elk with this cartridge.

Now, we practice shot placement - aim small, miss small. All of them have been 1 shot drops. We had an instance where the wild boar was a 2 fer. Shot hit the primary, killed it, passed through, and killed the secondary.

I'm really happy that people are interested in shooting this round, and shooting in general. Call it what you want, think about it how you will, but until you actually use it, STFU.

ST-U?
Easily Offended?

The 6.5 Needs More is a cute caliber.

Triggered?

 

[DLSJR]

I don't think we should be shooting game over 500 yards which is a freaking long shot hunting, even if you have the power, proper bullet, can hit a clay bird every shot you can't control when that animal shifts its weight and moves almost instantly.

But I’m sure you, like me, have heard Koolaid drinkers call the Needmore a 1,000 yard elk round. That’s simply foolish and stupid, but it’s repeated by many proponents of that cartridge.

 

[Just Gina]

 

[Hunter-Habib]

@Hunter-Habib

Well said, if we never progress we would still be using stick much less typing on our computers or phones.

I have little experience with 6.5X55. The experience that I did have. That combination that I shot would not hold a candle to the accuracy capabilities of my 6.5CM. I have shot a 6.5CM and had impacts on targets less than 1/2MOA out to 1300 yards. Have taken it's little brother (6CM) past 1600 yards. Hitting very small targets.

I also shoot some relatively new cartridges 6GT and 7PRC. Both do well, I'm sure someone will have something negative to say. Progress happens, people can get on board or live in the past. Time doesn't stand still, that much I have figured out in my short time on this rock.

Why thank you, Inline6. To quote renowned Pakistani tiger hunter Tahawar Ali Khan "Progress is often the opponent of tradition, but tradition is often the opponent of progress. A compromise is the only suitable answer". He said this in the context of hunting Royal Bengal tigers with a magazine rifle ( a pre '64 Winchester Model 70 in .375 Holland & Holland Magnum) while all other tiger hunters of his era were making exclusive use of English double rifles.

 

[CraigV]

ST-U?
Easily Offended?

The 6.5 Needs More is a cute caliber.

Triggered?

Nope, Just tired of experts saying what they say.

Tell me what you've killed with a caliber, and then we can go from there,

If you need something greater than .284 to kill anything in the America's, then maybe you should spend more time on the range,

But hey, you've got 7 posts, so maybe I should respect your opinion.

I've watched this post go on and on. Those who have shot this cartridge appreciate it, the others offer a bunch of lip service.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

@Hunter-Habib

Well said, if we never progress we would still be using stick much less typing on our computers or phones.

I have little experience with 6.5X55. The experience that I did have. That combination that I shot would not hold a candle to the accuracy capabilities of my 6.5CM. I have shot a 6.5CM and had impacts on targets less than 1/2MOA out to 1300 yards. Have taken it's little brother (6CM) past 1600 yards. Hitting very small targets.

I also shoot some relatively new cartridges 6GT and 7PRC. Both do well, I'm sure someone will have something negative to say. Progress happens, people can get on board or live in the past. Time doesn't stand still, that much I have figured out in my short time on this rock.

I’d be surprised if the same model rifles using the same brand of brass with the same bullets in any of the 6.5mms had drastically different accuracy and terminal performance.

Short/fat cartridges have advantages in efficiency of burn but they’re not magic. The performance of the 300wsm was not dramatically different from the 300 h&h.

I see people attribute the 6.5CMs success to “progress” but we should be realistic. This isn’t a paradigm shift like the invention of smokeless powder. It’s successful marketing.

The 6.5CM is a fine cartridge and if nothing else, it’s helped reloaders get good bullets for the old cartridges. But given the same advantages of modern bullets and powder, the old cartridges don’t really give anything up.

 

[HWL]

Do you mean the 6.5 Needs More?
It’s the best long range paper killer around.

Love this.... 6,5Creedmoor ~ 6,5LRPC

HWL

 

[Tam Dl]

My point exactly ! So the acceptance of this caliber stems from a market induced situation (availability) rather than any ballistic advantage over the .300 Holland & Holland Magnum.

Similarly, you have the identical scenario with the 6.5 Creedmoor. Factory loaded ammunition offerings are more diverse (on the current market) than the 6.5x55mm Swedish Mauser or the 6.5x54mm Mannlicher Schoenauer. T6.5 Creedmoor isn't ballistically any superior or inferior to either of these calibers. But is only popular on the market now, because ammunition and rifles for it are widely available.

It is a false analogy, because the 6.5 C is designed for long range, and long bullets, and different rifling than the Swede. I don't believe that that was an issue with the two 30s.

Also, most of the rifles that the C is put in are not warhorses, which is certainly what I want for any rifle I hunt with. The Swede is superbly accurate with bullets designed for hunting, and has been fit in rifles that are perfect for dealing with aggression of various forms. None of this is why the C exists. It isn't that I expect much bloodshed for the rest of my life, but I do own a property with relatively short open areas, horny moose, and bears that take their child custody duties seriously. In the overall picture, any rifle I own, had better feed every time.

I reload, though I could get Swede ammo if I needed it, far more easily than it was ever available when the cartridge was in it's heyday.

 

[Huntersedge]

Nope, Just tired of experts saying what they say.

Tell me what you've killed with a caliber, and then we can go from there,

If you need something greater than .284 to kill anything in the America's, then maybe you should spend more time on the range,

But hey, you've got 7 posts, so maybe I should respect your opinion.

I've watched this post go on and on. Those who have shot this cartridge appreciate it, the others offer a bunch of lip service.

Nope, Just tired of experts saying what they say.

Tell me what you've killed with a caliber, and then we can go from there,

If you need something greater than .284 to kill anything in the America's, then maybe you should spend more time on the range,

But hey, you've got 7 posts, so maybe I should respect your opinion.

I've watched this post go on and on. Those who have shot this cartridge appreciate it, the others offer a bunch of lip service.

40 years of shooting and hunting.
One shot double lung and top of the heart, 43” Cape Buffalo with my 70lb bow last September. He went 80 yards.

 

[MS 9x56]

Ok so this gives me mixed impressions about the 6.5 Creedmoor. On one hand, its a pretty big deal that the Barbie franchise has come out with a Creedmoor version of their Ken doll. Yet on the other hand he is on clearance and yet the shelf was still full.... And to make matters even more dismal for the outlook of the 6.5 Creedmoor.... My lovely Barbie collecting wife @Just Gina did come home with a shopping cart full of new Barbies, but alas Manbun Ken was not amongst them
View attachment 592887View attachment 592888

Hopefully a sign of the times.

 

[MS 9x56]

Gina, did you ever have a G.I. Joe "doll"? I never thought about it as a doll, but I had one and it came with accessories like a helmet, different uniforms, a semi auto Creedmoor rifle, boots, canteen, gloves, etc. Then if you got the Jeep for him to ride in, it had its own accessories like a Browning .35 Whelen machine gun on a tripod in the back, big tires, etc. LOL

My GI Joe carried an M 1 Garand and ammo belt with hand grenades. Just an old fudd I guess, but I wear it proudly. I have shot the man bun and found it lacking for my tastes.