Winchester Model 70 375 H&H vs CZ550 375 H&H

[One Day...]

No way a 550 in 375 weighs 11lbs.....

Absolutely agree... around ~9.5 lbs. depending on caliber and stock, iron sighted, and empty.

+ ~1 lbs. for a decent scope => total ~10 lbs.
+ ~1 lbs. rings, ammo, sling => total ~11 lbs.

 

[Rocked and Loaded]

The Winchester M-70 can be had in true Magnum length also, can also mount both Talley or regular rings…
And it is lighter, more handy rifle as a lot have reported. A lot will tell you that they prefer their 22” M-70 458 for this reason alone. Anyone that has read the 458 Win Mag thread has seen this.
It’s all in preference and personal likes but don’t call the Winchester a boys rifle!

Is the current mod 70 safari true magnum length or do you have to find an old one?

 

[One Day...]

I love my Stainless Classic Win 70 .300 Wby (on a B&C stock too). Until the R8 came around, it was my go-to Western fall & winter elk rifle.

The Winchester M-70 can be had in true Magnum length also

This is correct, but it involves work. Visually, this is what the various Winchester 70 "long" actions look like viewed from the magazine well:

“Standard” a.k.a. “long” Win 70 action. Cartridge length up to 3.34”, narrow magazine box. Typical application: .30-06 family (.25/06, .270 Win, .280 Rem, .35 Whelen, etc.) and similar non-magnum cartridges.

"H&H Magnum" Win 70 action. Cartridge length up to 3.64”, wide magazine box. Observe the lengthened magazine well at front and rear, and the shortened rear bridge to allow longer brass ejection. Typical application: H&H family (.300 H&H, .300 Wby, .375 H&H, 416 Rem, etc.).

Winchester's Custom Shop "Rigby-length" Win 70 action machined from a H&H magnum action. Cartridge length up to 3.84”, wide magazine box. Observe the lengthened magazine well by machining away most of the feed ramp and reducing to strict minimum the bottom lug retaining wall. Typical application: Rigby family (.416 Rigby, .450 Rigby, .338 Lapua, .378/.416/.460 Wby, etc.). I am not aware that the Custom Shop still exists (?).

This certainly works, the most famous example being probably Harry Selby's Rigby .416 based on a reworked standard-length K98 action, but even a .416-length action is too short for the Gibbs.

Is the current mod 70 safari true magnum length or do you have to find an old one?

To the best of my knowledge - but I have not looked at one in a while - the current Win 70 Safari is H&H length, which means perfect for .375 H&H and you can still shoehorn .416 Rem and .458 Lott in it.

Custom Shop "Rigby-length" Win 70 are very very few and very very far in between on the used market.

The Winchester M-70 ... can also mount both Talley or regular rings…

That is true too, but it requires mounting front and rear bases to accept the rings. Even if the factory 6-48 screw holes are re-drilled and taped for 8-40 screws, screws are by definition movable and four screws cannot begin to compare in indestructibility with integral bases.

And it is lighter, more handy rifle as a lot have reported. A lot will tell you that they prefer their 22” M-70 458 for this reason alone. Anyone that has read the 458 Win Mag thread has seen this.
It’s all in preference and personal likes but don’t call the Winchester a boys rifle!

I agree to all of that, and I am not making the case of the boy rifle vs the man rifle, which is silly.

I could go 22" or 25", although I am not sure that 3" make that big of a difference in handiness in real life. Conversely, it does shaves muzzle velocity and certainly increases markedly muzzle blast.

Setting aside the fact that I have become a 100% R8 guy, in the context of this discussions my preference for a DG rifle for far-away TIA Africa still goes to the CZ even in .375 because:

• I prefer integral scope mounts (they never fail)
• I prefer integral rear sight island (they never fail)
• I prefer integral front ramp (they never fail)
• I prefer 5+1 capacity (it is not uncommon to see clients' febrile attempts to replenish their magazine while the PH screams "reload, reload")
• I prefer heavier profile barrels that soak up recoil and do not throw scope in one's forehead in the rush of a less than perfect shot (oh yes it happens, a lot more than many believes). Although admittedly this applies much more to a comparison between Win 70 .458 Lott and CZ 550 .458 Lott.
• I prefer rifles that do not include cast "pot metal" components (as the Win 70 base plate was for a time. I do not know now (?).

This one comes from a .340 Wby...

As to weight, truly to each their own. Since my .375 H&H has always been scoped, from ZKK 602 to R8, I consider ~10+ lbs. as a baseline, and I continue to think, even at 65 years, that I cannot tell an 11 lbs. rifle on my shoulder from a 10 lbs. Truth be told, my scoped .458 Lott Selous R8 weighs in at exactly 11 lbs. 8 oz. unloaded and it does not bother me in the least. Maybe walking the neighborhood with a 12 lbs. gym plate slung from my shoulder every evening for 3 months prior to my safaris has something to do with it.

 

[CBH Australia]

Or instead of a current production, you could buy yourself some history and get a pre-64 model 70! If you find a working gun, not a mint collector rifle, they can be had for decent prices.

It would be nice to have one of each.
I have a CZ550 and think it would be nice to have the Winchester model 70 as it is a classic etc but then I would also want the Brno602 to compare them all.

 

[CZDiesel]

@One Day...

Thank you for that accurate and detailed post of the Winchester actions! Very good job!
And yes for sure a machined in base will always win over a screwed on base mount in strength but in my eyes it wins more in aesthetics! As you said that when using the largest base screws that are lock-tighted and torqued correctly this platform has proven to be able to take more recoil than we can lol
But again, spot on brother!