2nd Shot Expert Advice Please!

[Scott CWO]

Hey guys I recently bought a Dakota Traveler and went to sight it in today. I mounted and bore-sighted a Leupold VX-R 2-7x33 scope with Talley QD rings to the Talley bases already on the rifle. I’ve used Talley products on almost all my rifles and I am very familiar with Talley.

I got to my range and set up a target at 50 yards. I shot from sandbags on a bench and was very steady. I was shooting semi-custom ammo from Hendershot’s with a 300 grain Swift A-Frame that they sent me to try.

The first shot was great and about 1” low and 3/4” left. Pretty good for bore-sighted! Recoil quite moderate. I’m not recoil sensitive and shoot a 458 Lott regularly.

I chambered another round and settled in for the second shot. At the shot, my sight picture was just shy of a complete edge to edge image because I don’t like to crowd a scope on any rifle. I squeezed and the next thing I knew was I was about knocked out! I got scoped pretty bad for the first time in many, many years! Ouch!

The scope actually came off the rifle as well! I’ve never seen that happen! Once I got my wits back and the bleeding stopped, I took a bunch of pictures and retrieved the target. The second shot was almost off the paper and 7.5” higher and 3” to the right (see picture)! What the hell??

I then unloaded the empty case and it wasn’t hung up or stuck. Upon inspecting the scope and rings, the rear QD screw is bent! The rifle and bolt face seem fine but there is a slight loss of bluing on the extractor. I have attached pictures of everything and the empty cases. I’m not sure which casing was from the second shot.

I need some expert advice and opinions! Did the second round have too much powder? What the heck is going on here? I really don’t think the rear QD screw could have been bent when I mounted the scope. The lever on the screw was about touching the power ring after the second shot and I had a little trouble getting it off/out. There’s no way it was like that before I shot. I had the scope securely attached before I took the shots. Help!

 

[Hogpatrol]

I believe the scope was loosened on the first shot. The boltface and brass looks ok.

 

[roklok]

The primer on the left looks like it had higher pressure than the one on the right. That being said it doesn't look like it was subjected to the kind of pressure to cause what you describe happening. Was the recoil of the second shot significantly more ? Looking at your fired brass from a side profile, it appears that the shoulder of the right case is further forward. Maybe just an illusion from the photograph. If it is indeed further forward something major is wrong. I would be looking close at the takedown mechanism if the shoulders are indeed different.

EDIT: After googling the Dakota's takedown system I see the bolt locks directly into the barrel or barrel extension instead of receiver, so takedown system should have no bearing on incident. It still looks to me that the shoulders on your fired cases don't match, probably camera angle.

 

[Scott CWO]

The primer on the left looks like it had higher pressure than the one on the right. That being said it doesn't look like it was subjected to the kind of pressure to cause what you describe happening. Was the recoil of the second shot significantly more ? Looking at your fired brass from a side profile, it appears that the shoulder of the right case is further forward. Maybe just an illusion from the photograph. If it is indeed further forward something major is wrong. I would be looking close at the takedown mechanism if the shoulders are indeed different.

EDIT: After googling the Dakota's takedown system I see the bolt locks directly into the barrel or barrel extension instead of receiver, so takedown system should have no bearing on incident. It still looks to me that the shoulders on your fired cases don't match, probably camera angle.

As for recoil, I got scoped pretty good so that dominated my brain and I don’t remember the felt recoil to my shoulder.

Upon closer inspection, one case is uneven at the opening like there’s a small piece missing. The shoulders don’t look any different as far as I can see.

 

[Scott CWO]

As for recoil, I got scoped pretty good so that dominated my brain and I don’t remember the felt recoil to my shoulder.

Upon closer inspection, one case is uneven at the opening like there’s a small piece missing. The shoulders don’t look any different as far as I can see.

 

[Hogpatrol]

Is this a used or new rifle? If so and there seemed to be excessive pressure, would borescope the chamber for a carbon ring.

 

[roklok]

I tend to agree with Hogpatrol. Definitely take a close look at rifle, but it seems likely that the scope mounting is where you should focus. That would explain both disparate points of impact as well as the scope leaving the rifle and meeting your face.

 

[Scott CWO]

Is this a used or new rifle? If so and there seemed to be excessive pressure, would borescope the chamber for a carbon ring.

Not new but supposedly not fired more than a handful of times.

 

[Scott CWO]

I tend to agree with Hogpatrol. Definitely take a close look at rifle, but it seems likely that the scope mounting is where you should focus. That would explain both disparate points of impact as well as the scope leaving the rifle and meeting your face.

I’m not a reloader and don’t know much about the signs of high pressure other than a stuck case so figured I would get some advice.

My other 375s and my Lott all have Talley QD scope mounts so I am very familiar with them and was sure I had everything tight and correct but perhaps you are right about the scope. I thought maybe a hot load could have caused the flier shot and the scope came off after impacting me but I don’t know.

 

[RR 314]

Man, that is really odd. Especially if you are used to shooting a 458. I don’t care how hot it is, seems like something is way off. I would scope the .375 and .458 barrels before shooting again.

I know you stated that the case extracted fine, but were you too dazed to notice if the bolt lift was heavy? Understandable if so. That will flat out rattle somebody.

 

[Hogpatrol]

There's a faint ring mark on the front ring like possibly the scope moved rearward. I notice it's fairly close if not touching the tapered part of the bell. May indicate the rings weren't tight.

 

[Berettaco]

I’m with @Hogpatrol - I think there was a scope mount failure. If your first shot was on paper, the scope could have jumped up just enough to unseat it, guessing the rear ring due to the bent screw. This could cause your second shot to actually hit high - then the rearward recoil launched that scope back into your face. Obviously I wasn’t there - just a guess based on the pics and your info. The cases don’t show excessive pressure to any extent from the pics.

 

[450 Dakota]

I’m betting the 2nd shot went high because of the scope hitting you. If you have sights on it I would shoot a couple open sighted.

 

[Goat416]

I would definitely check the fit of the rings and bases. One of my Dakota's with quick detach Talley rings and bases needed to be adjusted to fit correctly. In my rifle's case it took very little to fix, but the rear ring and base didn't lock up right. The gunsmith shaved what looked like the smallest amount off the base of the ring and it corrected the issue. Mine just didn't feel quite right which prompted me to have it looked at before firing the rifle.

That bent screw from the rear ring looks very suspect, as others have stated I would verify the scope mount.