best bolt action for dangerous games

[Doug Hamilton]

Regardless of what you use in terms of action, cartridge, etc., the important thing to to shoot your rifle in practice - over and over again. Full magazine with hunting loads, sitting, off hand, on the sticks and off. Any flaws in you or the rifle will become apparent and can be remedied in advance of the hunt. Repeatable reliabilty and accuracy of your rifle and scope combination means that you will be confident. Confidence in your rifle and your ability to shoot it trumps everything else... it leads to correct shot placement, calms you when you are in tense situations and means you will be successful.

Before I took my new .404 Jeffery Mauser on safari I shot over 300 rounds through it in all conditions. I was wedded to the rifle and knew I could shoot it well.

So, you're saying that a hunter should be very familiar with a rifle, make sure it functions reliably, and shoot a lot to be a better shot. Gee, never heard that before.

In my case I had a Timney trigger and a M 70 type three position safety installed on my Mark X action .458. I then had another rifle built on the same action with the same modifications made in .300 Win Mag. The rifles are so similar as to be interchangeable. Reloading and shooting a .300 WM is much easier than obtaining and the components and shooting a .458. I knew the .458 would work well and I did not have to shoot it 300 times to know exactly what would happen when I pulled the trigger and threw the bolt on either rifle.

When I did get to shoot the .458 this year. I placed the bullet through the top of the heart and out the side. The bull ran about 25 yards and piled up dead. So it didn't really matter what action I was using, but knowing that a could depend on the rifle did give me a lot of confidence when I did shoot a buffalo.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

The one you have worked with for a long period of time and have honestly tried to break. In other words a big bore rifle that a gunsmith has worked on and you have shot rapid fire many times with different kinds of ammo proving its worthyness. This bench rest, single feeding of one type of hand loaded ammo (no handloads for DG!) is the opposite of what I am talking about.
There is not an out of the box DG rifle. each one has to be proven.
Take my word for it your life depends on it.
Philip

No hand loads for dangerous game? I can't quite agree with that. Properly done, hand loads are more dependable, consistent and accurate than most commercial ammo. Not a Good time to start reloading though. You should know what you are doing, and restrict yourself to new or once fired brass for the hunt.

 

[Inline6]

The one you have worked with for a long period of time and have honestly tried to break. In other words a big bore rifle that a gunsmith has worked on and you have shot rapid fire many times with different kinds of ammo proving its worthyness. This bench rest, single feeding of one type of hand loaded ammo (no handloads for DG!) is the opposite of what I am talking about.
There is not an out of the box DG rifle. each one has to be proven.
Take my word for it your life depends on it.
Philip

I'm not sure what you are getting at with the no hand loads? Maybe I'm reading what you have written the wrong way.

If given the chance I load all my ammo especially if it is going to be used for DG. I personally know what is in each round. No guess work, the bullet goes where it is supposed to. I'm in control 100% of my QC/QA process.

If you mean hand loading the rounds because they are out of spec. Turning your rifle into essentially a single shot to try to squeeze every bit of accuracy out of it. If that is what you mean by your statement I agree with what you are saying.

 

[BeeMaa]

My 2¢, Use the same tools as the guy who does it for a living.

In Africa my PH carried a 500 NE double rifle. Not exactly the tool for finishing a mortally wounded eland at over 200 yards. But the 404 Mauser did the job. My point is that the PH needs a rifle that he can use to keep his client whole in a tight corner, while the hunter needs a rifle that assures proper first shot placement with a more-than-adequate caliber, thus relieving his PH from the necessity to fire his 'stopper'.

@Hogpatrol - I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one for the very reason that @Nevada Mike stated. A traveling hunter and PH have very different jobs and their choice in kit will vary accordingly.

 

[BeeMaa]

In my case I had a Timney trigger and a M 70 type three position safety installed on my Mark X action .458. I then had another rifle built on the same action with the same modifications made in .300 Win Mag. The rifles are so similar as to be interchangeable. Reloading and shooting a .300 WM is much easier than obtaining and the components and shooting a .458. I knew the .458 would work well and I did not have to shoot it 300 times to know exactly what would happen when I pulled the trigger and threw the bolt on either rifle.

When I did get to shoot the .458 this year. I placed the bullet through the top of the heart and out the side. The bull ran about 25 yards and piled up dead. So it didn't really matter what action I was using, but knowing that a could depend on the rifle did give me a lot of confidence when I did shoot a buffalo.

This is another reason for the Blaser R8 that I didn't mention earlier...rifle fit and feel is exactly the same, along with the trigger being one of the best ever.

 

[Dr Ray]

Remington 700 short action.

Sorry couldn’t resist

Obviously
You are just so bad
Lol

 

[Dr Ray]

Well, I didn’t get the Memo. So I bought (2) SAKO’s in .375 H&H. So far no issues and I’m not even that lucky…

My first was a Right Handed Finnbear that killed a few. Second is a SAKO 85 Hunter Left Handed. It’s killed some…

I’ll stick with SAKO and continue to practice shooting to become as accurate a shot as my rifles allow.

When I do hunt DG I’ll try to avoid short-stroking the bolt to avoid what may get you run through if things go south after your first shot!

**I may sell my Finnbear in the near future because I’m not using it anymore.

I’m a Sako fan too

 

[Philip Glass]

I'm not sure what you are getting at with the no hand loads? Maybe I'm reading what you have written the wrong way.

If given the chance I load all my ammo especially if it is going to be used for DG. I personally know what is in each round. No guess work, the bullet goes where it is supposed to. I'm in control 100% of my QC/QA process.

If you mean hand loading the rounds because they are out of spec. Turning your rifle into essentially a single shot to try to squeeze every bit of accuracy out of it. If that is what you mean by your statement I agree with what you are saying.

Ask several experienced DG PH's if they would prefer for you to bring handloads.
I understand everyone is different and has different skills. For the most part handloading is a bad idea for DG. (hornests nest disturbed!)

 

[Philip Glass]

No hand loads for dangerous game? I can't quite agree with that. Properly done, hand loads are more dependable, consistent and accurate than most commercial ammo. Not a Good time to start reloading though. You should know what you are doing, and restrict yourself to new or once fired brass for the hunt.

Yall need to get out more. Ask a few experienced DG PH's if they would like you to bring handloads. Dont take my word for it.

 

[Philip Glass]

I am not sure I agree with you, Phillip. While factory rounds are pretty reliable, handloading allows you to tune and adjust you loads for your rifle, assuring reliable feeding and accuracy. Also allows you to choose exactly the bullet you want to use. Further, it makes hundreds of hunting rounds for practice available for much less money than the cost of a few boxes of factory ammo.

Talking to the people at a well known Arizona shooting school about their DG shooting course, they emphasized to need to shoot hundreds of round during their training course. I agree - this tests the rifle and creates confidence in the shooter.

Of course, when you are handloading you need to have both eyes open, focus on the task and know how to develop and produce safe, reliable ammo.

Mike,
no one will actually develop a single load and shoot it hundreds of times in hunting scenarios with their big bore. They also rarely go hunt with it before the safari. Obviously if this was true, common practice yall would have no argument from me.
They tinker and tinker until the time of the DG hunt and then disaster! The gun jams with a new load they "worked up".
Dont get me wrong handloading has its place. Mountain hunting for instance where shots are long and conditions difficult. Having the right load for your rifle whether custom or factory makes a difference.
Regards,
Philip

 

[TSIBINDI]

...Hand loads for DG? Not a good idea? PH's discourage the use? This is all news to me.

Zambia: Hippo, lion, and buffalo shot with handloads .416 Taylor. Zimbabwe: Leopard, .270Win; buffalo(s) .416 Taylor/.458WM; elephant(s) .416 Taylor,/.458WM, /.450Rigby, and .505Gibbs all shot with handloads.

Granted, this is a short list of countries, but the Safari Operators I dealt with were more interested in firearm safety, adequate caliber for DG, and shooting skill. Twenty-four trips 1988 thru 2017, I never had a negative comment regarding my ammunition choice.

 

[NIGHTHAWK]

I’ve been hand loading for 10 years. I’ve never had an incident. I’ve also had custom match ammo made through a custom rifle builder. I haven’t purchased factory ammo for a long time. Exception would be .22 LR…

I have not heard any objection from my PH or others I’ve been around. In fact my PH tried to buy my hand loads the last 3 trips. I’ve given him about 60 Rounds of hand loaded .375 H&H (270, 300, and 350 grain) and 40 to 60 rounds of 7MM and .243. I do use new brass, control specs, and use exacting standards.

I’d be interested to hear of how many actual failures or incidents have occurred during DG hunting from hand loading. It is a great topic and something that deserves some vetting. This is the first warning I’ve gleaned…

 

[mark-hunter]

The rifles are so similar as to be interchangeable. Reloading and shooting a .300 WM is much easier than obtaining and the components and shooting a .458. I knew the .458 would work well and I did not have to shoot it 300 times to know exactly what would happen when I pulled the trigger and threw the bolt on either rifle.

I agree with this philosophy.
My training starts with 22lr, goes up to 308 win, then 30-06 (mostly FMJ) then I conclude the training with up to 10-15 shots 375 (with cheapest ammo).
Trigger time, is trigger time. Muscle memory is muscle memory. Additional shots with 375 is more of adjustment to recoil, and getting my trust in the rifle, to perform well, rather then improving my skills, which are built on smaller calibers
(and it did perform well in the Africa)

 

[Doug Hamilton]

Yall need to get out more. Ask a few experienced DG PH's if they would like you to bring handloads. Dont take my word for it.

Okay. I won't take your word for it.
It is a well known fact that certain cartridges will only perform at their best with carefully developed hand loads. My last PH uses hand loads exclusively in his stopping rifle. One of his regular clients loads them and brings them to him.

 

[Frederik]

Loading ammo for your rifle is part of the adventure and fun.
Normal logic needs to used if you are an old reloader and have tested the load great if you are new to it I would be very carefull and test properly.

Normal drill for hunting DG is to cycle each round you will be brinning on the hunt and that is normally if there is an issue it would be picked up. Between me and my son we shoot 300 rounds of big bore each year all reloads so I suppose that is enough for testing.

 

[Nevada Mike]

...Normal drill for hunting DG is to cycle each round you will be brinning on the hunt and that is normally if there is an issue it would be picked up...

I would add that these rounds should be loaded in the magazine and cycled from the magazine to assure feeding, chambering, and ejection.

 

[Philip Glass]

Okay. I won't take your word for it.
It is a well known fact that certain cartridges will only perform at their best with carefully developed hand loads. My last PH uses hand loads exclusively in his stopping rifle. One of his regular clients loads them and brings them to him.

And I personally know PH's whos guns have jammed wih reloads in dangerous situations. Ive been doing this a while.
To each his own.

 

[Wyatt Smith]

And I personally know PH's whos guns have jammed wih reloads in dangerous situations. Ive been doing this a while.
To each his own.

He should have read @Nevada Mike above post. Always make sure the ammo fits in the gun, every single round. There is nothing wrong with proper reloads.

 

[Inline6]

And I personally know PH's whos guns have jammed wih reloads in dangerous situations. Ive been doing this a while.
To each his own.

The thing is we also have reports of factory ammo failing too. It doesn't matter what you use as long as you are test it. Man made it, it can fail no matter the place it came from.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

And I personally know PH's whos guns have jammed wih reloads in dangerous situations. Ive been doing this a while.
To each his own.

I've been around a long time too. I can only remember three times a round failed to function. Each time it was from a commercially loaded cartridget. Once it was with a shotgun and the wad stopped mid barrel. Had I not realized that the sound was "off" on the last shot and pulled the trigger again, the result would surely have been catastrophic. I have also seen a couple of squib loads in training with the state Department of Corrections. All of the ammo we used was new factory loaded in original boxes. It happens. I've never had a malfunction with any of my own carefully handcrafted ammunition. Some people might not be as careful as I am. I check every case for length, make sure every flash hole, and weigh every charge down to the last kernal. Then I load them all in the magazine and cycle them through the action of the rifle I am going to use. When I load for dangerous game I use only once fired brass. In short, I do the things that cannot happen in mass produced factory ammunition. I do this in order to get better ammunition, not just as good as factory loads.
Your opinion is naive and arrogant. Go get some real shooting experience and come back.