SOUTH AFRICA: Kuche Safaris

[buck wild]

@Schatzi
In the mean time I think it would be good if Kuche Safaris could shed a little light on the scene…..

This crossed my mind also, and in the past similar things have happened (often a train wreck of a different caliber), BUT here there's not enough substance in original post for Kuche to combat.

 

[Katy Darren]

I appreciate all those who’ve chimed in with their experiences. I have a group going next year to Kuche.

I’ve met (at Houston Safari Club event) and interacted a good bit with Koos and Cobus, and have recommendations from other outfitters that know him that he’s a good guy and runs a good operation. I’ve appreciated the many reports put on here since I’ve been on AH. Clearly the OP is off base there.

We go in understanding the number of people potentially there, heck we’ll be 11, 5 non hunters, ourselves! I imagine many of the numbers at dinner include non hunters since it’s a good deal to bring your family. I’ve heard enough of the size of their concessions and options they have there to be comfortable we won’t be running into other groups and will have opportunity for many good trophy animals in spot and stalk situations. His model is based on you wanting to add days and animals to his package deals, it’s in his business best interest to make sure the hunt is a good experience.

It will be our first Safari and I appreciate how this situation isn’t everyone’s cup of tea and perhaps next trips we’ll experience the smaller, more intimate hunt. I’ve often been on fishing and hunting trips with other groups and enjoy the stories and camaraderie that comes from people being on a great adventure in a beautiful place so for this first one I’m good.

 

[Mekaniks]

This crossed my mind also, and in the past similar things have happened (often a train wreck of a different caliber), BUT here there's not enough substance in original post for Kuche to combat.

You may be correct.

But, I will bet that Kuche has some insight into more of the story….Regardless of how off the wall the accusations are,

 

[Deepfork]

Go through this thread and generally what you see is lots of people who have hunted with Kuche, and think they are great. And Lots of of others who don't like what has happened in South Africa in general talking about issues they could see happening that don't exist a Kuche.

All of the criticism in this thread is predictable, same thing happens whenever there is any activity about hunting in South Africa. Criticism from ignorance (lack of real(direct) knowledge) is meaningless. Its called Hearsay in court, its not admissible. A nice way of saying its meaningless. So yes everyone one of you that has no experience Kuche, but choose to criticize them need to get a new hobby. I prop them up because I know them and what they do from personal experience. I spent a lot of time talking to our outfitter (Kuche) and multiple land (game farm) owners about sustainability and management practices. I was impressed and appreciative as many of you haters would be if you took the time to look at everything going on in South Africa and not just accept the few bad apples you hear about as the norm.

Yes there are lots of hunters sleeping and eating dinner in Kuches base camp in Limpopo. I enjoyed spending time around the fire pit in the evenings with every one of them. This is what I want to do in the evenings! Also..... seven days of hunting and I did not once catch a glimpse of another hunter while in the field that I did not get on the airplane with in Oklahoma.

Kuche Safaris is very straight forward about what they do. Why do some of you feel the need to criticize if you have not met the players or experienced what they have to offer?

I could go on for hours but for the sake of my blood pressure I think I'll stop here!

 

[Scott CWO]

Go through this thread and generally what you see is lots of people who have hunted with Kuche, and think they are great. And Lots of of others who don't like what has happened in South Africa in general talking about issues they could see happening that don't exist a Kuche.

All of the criticism in this thread is predictable, same thing happens whenever there is any activity about hunting in South Africa. Criticism from ignorance (lack of real(direct) knowledge) is meaningless. Its called Hearsay in court, its not admissible. A nice way of saying its meaningless. So yes everyone one of you that has no experience Kuche, but choose to criticize them need to get a new hobby. I prop them up because I know them and what they do from personal experience. I spent a lot of time talking to our outfitter (Kuche) and multiple land (game farm) owners about sustainability and management practices. I was impressed and appreciative as many of you haters would be if you took the time to look at everything going on in South Africa and not just accept the few bad apples you hear about as the norm.

Yes there are lots of hunters sleeping and eating dinner in Kuches base camp in Limpopo. I enjoyed spending time around the fire pit in the evenings with every one of them. This is what I want to do in the evenings! Also..... seven days of hunting and I did not once catch a glimpse of another hunter while in the field that I did not get on the airplane with in Oklahoma.

Kuche Safaris is very straight forward about what they do. Why do some of you feel the need to criticize if you have not met the players or experienced what they have to offer?

I could go on for hours but for the sake of my blood pressure I think I'll stop here!

I would agree. I have never hunted in South Africa but have hunted Zim, Moz three times, Botswana, Zambia, CAR and am headed for my second trip to Tanzania this year. I have usually been the only hunter in camp except for one Moz trip where there were four of us.

As someone in the hunting industry, I don't see a problem with Kuche's operation, even if it might not be for some people. The marketplace is big and there are several options for hunting in Africa. This is one option. Seems to me like Koos is a good manager and has a fairly good handle on this operation. Lots of moving parts to keep in check. Seems like he has lots of ranches to hunt to spread out the hunting pressure and just chooses to house everyone at one camp, which is much more efficient and saves everyone some money. With this size of operation, it would be harder to have multiple camps with multiple cooks and staff. It is probably easier to have the lodging and meals consolidated in one location but still provide uncrowded hunting on the ranches.

 

[375Fox]

Go through this thread and generally what you see is lots of people who have hunted with Kuche, and think they are great. And Lots of of others who don't like what has happened in South Africa in general talking about issues they could see happening that don't exist a Kuche.

All of the criticism in this thread is predictable, same thing happens whenever there is any activity about hunting in South Africa. Criticism from ignorance (lack of real(direct) knowledge) is meaningless. Its called Hearsay in court, its not admissible. A nice way of saying its meaningless. So yes everyone one of you that has no experience Kuche, but choose to criticize them need to get a new hobby. I prop them up because I know them and what they do from personal experience. I spent a lot of time talking to our outfitter (Kuche) and multiple land (game farm) owners about sustainability and management practices. I was impressed and appreciative as many of you haters would be if you took the time to look at everything going on in South Africa and not just accept the few bad apples you hear about as the norm.

Yes there are lots of hunters sleeping and eating dinner in Kuches base camp in Limpopo. I enjoyed spending time around the fire pit in the evenings with every one of them. This is what I want to do in the evenings! Also..... seven days of hunting and I did not once catch a glimpse of another hunter while in the field that I did not get on the airplane with in Oklahoma.

Kuche Safaris is very straight forward about what they do. Why do some of you feel the need to criticize if you have not met the players or experienced what they have to offer?

I could go on for hours but for the sake of my blood pressure I think I'll stop here!

I see something very different. I see first time African hunters defending what has been their best hunting experience so far and soon to be first time African hunters hoping for their best hunting experience. The more times you hunt South Africa the more you may begin to question what you’ve been told about the sustainability and management practices you’ve discussed with these landowners especially on the industrial scale described.

 

[Scott CWO]

I see something very different. I see first time African hunters defending what has been their best hunting experience so far and soon to be first time African hunters hoping for their best hunting experience. The more times you hunt South Africa the more you may begin to question what you’ve been told about the sustainability and management practices you’ve discussed with these landowners especially on the industrial scale described.

Seems they are not all hunting on one ranch.

 

[Deepfork]

I see something very different. I see first time African hunters defending what has been their best hunting experience so far and soon to be first time African hunters hoping for their best hunting experience. The more times you hunt South Africa the more you may begin to question what you’ve been told about the sustainability and management practices you’ve discussed with these landowners especially on the industrial scale described.

Okay...around that crowded fire pit in the evenings at Kuches base camp in Limpopo there were some first timers. But the majority were not. Quite a few had been to Africa many times, many outfitters to different countries and were there because they enjoyed being there.

 

[375Fox]

Seems they are not all hunting on one ranch.

Another member wrote there were 40 hunters in camp his first week. That takes a huge amount of land to sustain that and a large number of landowners. The outfitter isn’t managing each property directly. If there is money to be made, the landowners will bring in more game maybe yearly maybe a few times a year. The management is largely out of the outfitter’s control but he will still hunt these properties. It’s normal business in South Africa. This business model just put it on an industrial scale. I’ve been on 4 trips to South Africa and I’ve seen aspects of what I don’t want to see on every trip even when I’m not looking, especially in Limpopo. To say none of these practices exist at kuche safaris is ridiculous. They aren’t necessary one of the bad apples, but it’s an industrial scale almost in their own class.

 

[375Fox]

Okay...around that crowded fire pit in the evenings at Kuches base camp in Limpopo there were some first timers. But the majority were not. Quite a few had been to Africa many times, many outfitters to different countries and were there because they enjoyed being there.

I’ll watch for the reports here from those hunters. The Kuche reports seem to be primarily from first time African hunters. The auctions and free safari gun seem be be very good marketing strategies for them.

 

[Deepfork]

I’ll watch for the reports here from those hunters. The Kuche reports seem to be primarily from first time African hunters. The auctions and free safari gun seem be be very good marketing strategies for them.

You are the person I was talking about. No first hand knowledge.

Those are good marketing strategies. But what sustains them is return clients that had good experiences on their first hunt.

 

[lockingblock]

Another member wrote there were 40 hunters in camp his first week. That takes a huge amount of land to sustain that and a large number of landowners. The outfitter isn’t managing each property directly. If there is money to be made, the landowners will bring in more game maybe yearly maybe a few times a year. The management is largely out of the outfitter’s control but he will still hunt these properties. It’s normal business in South Africa. This business model just put it on an industrial scale. I’ve been on 4 trips to South Africa and I’ve seen aspects of what I don’t want to see on every trip even when I’m not looking, especially in Limpopo. To say none of these practices exist at kuche safaris is ridiculous. They aren’t necessary one of the bad apples, but it’s an industrial scale almost in their own class.

This.

That has to be put and take, just due to volume. Not my cup of tea, but everyone is different.

 

[Rubberhead]

I've said it before, "Africa has something for everyone". But, what's perfect for me is miserable for someone else.

The stories of outfitters being down-right dishonest are exceedingly rare. So, most if not all the blame for hiring an outfitter/PH that aren't a good fit fall directly on the customer. Someone should not expect to make a beer-driven, spur-of-the-moment decision to bid on a safari at a Duck Unlimited event then expect it to be a good fit - it probably won't be.

 

[HookMeUpII]

If the four of you return, I’ll be very interested to hear if you have the same 3 PHs or if same 3 PHs even still work there. With 40 clients in camp, I would estimate that’s at least 30 PHs. I’m glad you had a great hunt, but you also have no other African hunts to compare it to. 30 PHs, 40 clients at one time, that’s a huge number of variables that don’t point to a consistent experience. Plains game trophies especially in South Africa are generally pretty easy to stack, it’s the smaller details that lead to a consistent experience. I hope the initial post is wildly exaggerated but I can see one person’s experience being very different than another’s by the week.

I can appreciate our minimal experience and your comments. I spoke to Koos before I left. I asked when (not it) I return could I request the same PH, Rudolph. That was one of my few conditions to return. He said, yes, absolutely. He said with time, he would see to it. Now obviously there are other factors such as maybe the PH decides to do something else with his life, unforeseen circumstances, etc. However, Koos made this promise.

2 in our group are already planning a return. I unfortunately cannot go with them at the time they are planning to go as we plan to move around that time. 1 from the group wants to return, but his finances are a consideration. All said and done, that's a 100% repeat client rate.

OP's post seems like it has a purpose, and not a fair or unbias one.

 

[Deepfork]

Maybe but the posts by Denvir Tire mostly align to the first post. Hopefully he will write a full report. The first post from OP carries no credibility without details.

Really....mostly align? Denvir did not say there we no animals, no food or call any one a liar.

 

[HookMeUpII]

Okay...around that crowded fire pit in the evenings at Kuches base camp in Limpopo there were some first timers. But the majority were not. Quite a few had been to Africa many times, many outfitters to different countries and were there because they enjoyed being there.

I would say the majority of the hunters we met in camp were repeat hunters. Some of them on their 3rd time with Kuche. Ironically, we were one of the only first-timers.

 

[HookMeUpII]

I think I am going to leave this thread with this statement. You can only state so much for a positive experience before people just try to pick apart things that you saw with your own two eyes, with boots on the ground. The commenters in this thread are as follows:

1) People who have been and are dissatisfied - 2 (Schatzi and Denvir Tire)
2) People who have been and are satisfied and would return - 5-6 or so? (Myself included)
3) People who have admittedly NOT been and are conjecturing based on some potentially bias info.

As I said, I have no vested interest or anything to gain monetarily by defending Kuche. They provided a good experience, expressed concern and desire to make sure their clientele had a good time, and we all did. Hopefully, people will see the number of good reviews outnumbering the bad when they search the forum.

 

[Katy Darren]

I would say the majority of the hunters we met in camp were repeat hunters. Some of them on their 3rd time with Kuche. Ironically, we were one of the only first-timers.

Keep taking em down Hook! LOL. Hey, repeat customers on such a big trip / commitment is huge. It really says all you need to know. I’ve seen enough responses here to know my first impressions and research are on point and this person is an anomaly.

 

[booker]

I do sale and raffle the Kuche Safari donated hunts through Ducks Unlimited events. I personally have never hunted with them as I use other outfits that have treated me great historically. As for persons who purchase these hunts and take them I have never heard anything bad about them. Just a few things that they wished would have been a bit different. for Example the number of clients in camp at one time and the food being good but not great.

Hunters who have won this hunt that have been to SA before will generally say they have hunted better places. Those who have never been typically say it was an outstanding trip and will buy the hunt again at our events.

Koos and Kuche Safari's have helped raise hundreds of thousands of dollars for Conservation and helped introduce new people to the Africa hunting lifestyle. The crew is alright with me and I wish the hunters and outfit all the luck and safe hunting.

 

[Scott CWO]

Another member wrote there were 40 hunters in camp his first week. That takes a huge amount of land to sustain that and a large number of landowners. The outfitter isn’t managing each property directly. If there is money to be made, the landowners will bring in more game maybe yearly maybe a few times a year. The management is largely out of the outfitter’s control but he will still hunt these properties. It’s normal business in South Africa. This business model just put it on an industrial scale. I’ve been on 4 trips to South Africa and I’ve seen aspects of what I don’t want to see on every trip even when I’m not looking, especially in Limpopo. To say none of these practices exist at kuche safaris is ridiculous. They aren’t necessary one of the bad apples, but it’s an industrial scale almost in their own class.

Could be. Depends on how many ranches they use to spread the pressure. I wonder how many ranches they lease? Some of the people were likely observers but either way, that’s a lot of people. Definitely not my cup of tea but to each his own.