The Quality of American Firearms...

[FairChase]

...The Winchester is a better value than the Steyr.

Steyr Pro Hunter in .308 Win. approx. $680
Winchester M70 in .308 Win. approx $690

So many that have responded previously have been saying that they would never pay so much more for a "Premium or Custom" rifle like a Steyr. As you can see, they wouldn't have to pay more. So, would you still rather purchase a Remington, Winchester, etc. And considering this, would the above statement still be accurate?

 

[Desert Dog]

Steyr Pro Hunter in .308 Win. approx. $680
Winchester M70 in .308 Win. approx $690

That model of Steyr, the pro hunter, is very ugly compared to the M70 in the same price range. Although it is probably a very functional rifle like all the others in that price range, the stock form is not as pleasing to the eye as an M70 or Tikka in the same price range. Not as bad as the ugliest rifle ever made (the Steyr Scout), but pretty close. The really good looking Steyr guns are more than double the cost of the pro hunter. Just my opinion, but probably a pretty universal opinion as the low volume of sales would indicate.

The Steyr Classic II that I saw was a very handsome gun, just too damn pricey for what it was.

 

[lcq]

Steyr Pro Hunter in .308 Win. approx. $680
Winchester M70 in .308 Win. approx $690

So many that have responded previously have been saying that they would never pay so much more for a "Premium or Custom" rifle like a Steyr. As you can see, they wouldn't have to pay more. So, would you still rather purchase a Remington, Winchester, etc. And considering this, would the above statement still be accurate?

$870

http://www.eurooptic.com/steyr-pro-hunter-rifles.aspx

 

[FairChase]

$870

http://www.eurooptic.com/steyr-pro-hunter-rifles.aspx

That's EuroOptic... Check out Bud's Guns. More in line with my prices.

 

[tarbe]

(Spoken in my best Cody @Bullthrower338 voice)..."Life's too short to hunt with an ugly rifle"!

Oh, ooohhhh yeah. I can hear him saying that!

 

[wesheltonj]

If Wikipedia is right those new Winchesters are assemble in Portugal, by FN. Not exactly made in the USA but the name is.

 

[FairChase]

If Wikipedia is right those new Winchesters are assemble in Portugal, by FN. Not exactly made in the USA but the name is.

An excellent observation! The company is now under FN as the "U.S. Repeating Arms Company". It closed its New Haven, CT facility back in 2006.

 

[Bullthrower338]

Here is a Steyr that I forgot about, the M95 8x56. A very cool rifle that now that I found it, I'm going to shoot some of that 1942 ammo I have laying around through her this weekend. A rifle ahead of its time IMO. These are great fun to pull a trigger on!

 

[Desert Dog]

An excellent observation! The company is now under FN as the "U.S. Repeating Arms Company". It closed its New Haven, CT facility back in 2006.

In 2007, they moved M70 production to the FN plant in South Carolina, made by the same people and equipment that make the M240/M249 SAW and M16 for the military. I own two of these South Carolina guns and they are the finest guns that Winchester has ever produced - even better than the pre-war and pre-64 M70s. The Hammer forged barrels are PERFECT and super accurate, the wood is excellent quality with perfect checkering, and the receivers have zero blemishes or rough spots.

Last year, they moved assembly over to the Browning facility in Portugal, where I believe M70s are still assembled using FN parts from South Carolina. I have not shot one of those rifles. I handled a few in the shop and they seem to be assembled with the same level of quality.

FN really gave the consumer what they wanted with the new M70.

 

[Just Passing Through]

Maybe a better questions is - Why would someone continually insult another man's rifle?

Or better still - Would you insult another man's rifle to his face?

 

[shuter]

In 2007, they moved M70 production to the FN plant in South Carolina, made by the same people and equipment that make the M240/M249 SAW and M16 for the military. I own two of these South Carolina guns and they are the finest guns that Winchester has ever produced - even better than the pre-war and pre-64 M70s. The Hammer forged barrels are PERFECT and super accurate, the wood is excellent quality with perfect checkering, and the receivers have zero blemishes or rough spots.

Last year, they moved assembly over to the Browning facility in Portugal, where I believe M70s are still assembled using FN parts from South Carolina. I have not shot one of those rifles. I handled a few in the shop and they seem to be assembled with the same level of quality.

FN really gave the consumer what they wanted with the new M70.

My "Assembled in Portugal" M70 .375 is perfect. Beautifully made and accurate, with a fantastic factory trigger. Wood to metal fit and other aspects of assembly are spot on. Frankly, the current crop of Rugers that I've seen, handled, and shot have been well-done, as was as a newish Model 700 Remington. I think the state of U.S. firearms - despite mergers and consolidation that aren't necessarily positive developments in my opinion - is pretty solid.

 

[Synergy]

at least where I live, the problem with american guns is the resale values vs european guns. Accuracy wise, they are the same

 

[shuter]

Steyr Pro Hunter in .308 Win. approx. $680
Winchester M70 in .308 Win. approx $690

So many that have responded previously have been saying that they would never pay so much more for a "Premium or Custom" rifle like a Steyr. As you can see, they wouldn't have to pay more. So, would you still rather purchase a Remington, Winchester, etc. And considering this, would the above statement still be accurate?

I'd take the Winchester M70 over the Steyr Pro Hunter in a New York minute, for the same money. The M70 is time-tested, with a well-proven safety, and has not a single plastic or polymer part anywhere on its barreled action. The M70 can also be easily rebarreled if needed/desired. It's my understanding that the Steyr uses a funky "pressed in" bushing to which the bolt lugs mate, which would mean that only the factory could rebarrel. If I'm wrong about that, I stand corrected. As TR said, "personally, I prefer the Winchester!"

 

[Panielsen]

For the same money, I am still with Winchester. Mine has been through heavy brush, driving rain, and the heat of Africa in December and still performed like a nice day at the range when needed. I am knocking the Steyr as I haven't ever held one let alone fired it, but after looking at the website in this thread I see a similar action to the new lower price point rifles even the American companies such as Ruger, Remington, and Winchester are putting out. They all appear to have a tubular type action and no claw extractor. I think it very tough to beat the positive control of a Mauser style action for dangerous game. The Model 70 uses classic looks, Mauser action, an awesome trigger, and is damn accurate. Until I get a double, that Winchester goes with me as my main rifle. Hell, AFTER I get a double the Model 70 will be along just in case! Hard rifle to beat!

 

[FairChase]

Maybe a better questions is - Why would someone continually insult another man's rifle?

Or better still - Would you insult another man's rifle to his face?

I don't feel I or anyone else has been insulting in this conversation. Most have simply responded to questions or comments presented to this thread about a specific rifle. For me, it started when someone asked me what a Steyr could do that a Remington could not do. Otherwise, I have not focused on any particular brand unless brought up in the conversation.

Of course it is opinionated banter, but we are all able to make our own decisions on what is good and what is BS while still being gentlemen.

 

[Panielsen]

I don't feel I or anyone else has been insulting in this conversation. Most have simply responded to questions or comments presented to this thread about a specific rifle. For me, it started when someone asked me what a Steyr could do that a Remington could not do. Otherwise, I have not focused on any particular brand unless brought up in the conversation.

Of course it is opinionated banter, but we are all able to make our own decisions on what is good and what is BS while still being gentlemen.

Hell, I don't think you offended anyone @FairChase. I think people are just proud of their American iron they take around the world and a little touchy as some snub their noses at US products compared to European. Personally, I like hearing the WHY's when people stand by a product! For example, when I go to the range I like talking to people to see what they liked or disliked about their rifles, pistols, etc. When asked, I will happily tell you WHY I own, carry, or hunt with the rifles/pistols I have. Being long time soldier, I simply like what works and adapt to the rest. As if I remember you are a dealer? I would say tell us what makes the Steyr worth the money and it's advantages.

 

[spike.t]

"Maybe a better questions is - Why would someone continually insult another man's rifle?

Or better still - Would you insult another man's rifle to his face?"

might insult their wife , but never their rifle........................nope just had a think about PR and the sense of humour failure........so yup i will have to insult the rifle due to health and safety issues

 

[Lomadelray]

My father, from the time he was 12 years old until he passed, did all of his hunting with just two rifles. A Winchester 94 in 30-30, and a Winchester M70 in 300 win mag. He hit everything he shot at, usually not more than once; and simply made stacks of dead game from north central Pennsylvania to Barrow Alaska. Whitetail, blacktail, bear, moose, sheep, caribou, all efficiently made dead.

He never experienced a failure to feed, eject, or any other kind. His experience, I think, is not all that unique in America, nor unique across the other manufacturers, Ruger, Remington, etc.

So to take a stab at the original question; why do Americans prefer the standard American rifle over other options?

Simply this:
1. Availability
2. Price
3. Results

A few others here have asked a similar version of the following question, and I would be interested to hear an answer:

Why should the average American hunter, pay $2-$5k for a supposedly vastly superior rifle, when, say for example, a Marlin XL7 in 30-06 available for about $250 can shoot a cloverleaf at 100 yards and fill the freezer just as well?

Peace

 

[PHOENIX PHIL]

"Maybe a better questions is - Why would someone continually insult another man's rifle?

Or better still - Would you insult another man's rifle to his face?"

might insult their wife , but never their rifle........................nope just had a think about PR and the sense of humour failure........so yup i will have to insult the rifle due to health and safety issues

I know I wouldn't insult Rocky!

 

[tarbe]

Back to the original question:

"Why do so many Americans prefer to buy the standard American made hunting rifle (my brother calls them "RemChesterby's") when there are clearly better made rifles available? e.g., Steyr, CZ and a number of smaller American manufacturers like Montana Rifle Co.? (Yes, they had issues early on...)"

Pondering this question once again, I was reminded that I have purchased probably 30 vehicles over the years. Only one was American made. Most have been Toyota, Volvo, VW and Mercedes. Of perhaps 100 firearms, only my Glocks are not made in the USA.

Perhaps the foreign firearm manufacturers are simply not very good at marketing to Americans?

If Steyr wanted to sell more guns to Americans, it would really be pretty simple.

Find out what keeps Americans from choosing your product now, and address those concerns either through education or product/service upgrades/changes.

Perhaps they don't really want to sell more here?