Video of giraffe harvested with 6mm

[gbflyer]

It’s a little more than a chest beating video. It’s a small caliber agenda being pushed on a different forum. It is nice to see this is one of few topics AH almost unanimously agrees on though.

True. They did take a variety of animals with the same cartridge with similar results however. Apparently whoever the PH was seemed to be OK with it?

 

[gbflyer]

Okay. So in this one circumstance, a broadside shot at a standing animal a .243 reached the top of the heart and the giraffe died. I'm sure that a shot to the top of the neck where it meets the skull would also have resulted in death for the animal. Now does that make the .243 an appropriate caliber for hunting a game animal of this size? Most animals do not stand still in the perfect position waiting to be executed. Quartered away, or quartered towards the shooter the shot would have been impossible for such a light cartridge. This was a stunt and nothing more. No hunter in a real hunting situation would do it.

True. I never even get that close to a deer. Lol.

 

[375Fox]

True. They did take a variety of animals with the same cartridge with similar results however. Apparently whoever the PH was seemed to be OK with it?

Many PHs don’t have the financial ability to turn business away either. I read about it on that other forum after this thread. He said his PH was hesitant. I don’t like that this was performed as a target shooting stunt to back up their small caliber agenda, but the giraffe did die efficiently. However, many hunting situations aren’t picture perfect with a perfect rest and perfect shot presentation. Also, his 6mm was pushing a 115 gr bullet at 3250 fps. That actually pushes it towards a 25 caliber not the average 243/6mm. I find the small caliber agenda and its “data collection” irresponsible for a few reasons Ive already noted. This was also all done by Roy Weatherby previously in the 1950s. He shot a buffalo with his 257 to prove a point as well. It’s not proving anything new.

 

[Daisy]

Many PHs don’t have the financial ability to turn business away either. I read about it on that other forum after this thread. He said his PH was hesitant. I don’t like that this was performed as a target shooting stunt to back up their small caliber agenda, but the giraffe did die efficiently. However, many hunting situations aren’t picture perfect with a perfect rest and perfect shot presentation. Also, his 6mm was pushing a 115 gr bullet at 3250 fps. That actually pushes it towards a 25 caliber not the average 243/6mm. I find the small caliber agenda and its “data collection” irresponsible for a few reasons Ive already noted. This was also all done by Roy Weatherby previously in the 1950s. He shot a buffalo with his 257 to prove a point as well. It’s not proving anything new.

Nice fair post. I agree with most of this.

What’s your thoughts on bow hunting in Africa? These 6mm at 3250 and fragmenting bullets have at least the damaging effects as an arrow don’t they?

 

[375Fox]

Nice fair post. I agree with most of this.

What’s your thoughts on bow hunting in Africa? These 6mm at 3250 and fragmenting bullets have at least the damaging effects as an arrow don’t they?

I will lose this argument if I say my full opinion because I’m not a fan of archery hunting. However if it was choosing a small caliber lead fragmenting bullet vs a heavy arrow with a broadhead for a heart lung shot on a larger animal, I’d choose the bow. It has a precedent of achieving necessary penetration. I think they are losing something of the African experience by doing it, but archery hunters in a blind over water or feed are also waiting for the best shot presentation. That’s not always presented on a spot and stalk hunt with rifle in the brush.

Now If you were to ask me bow or 6mm with monolithic or bonded bullet on larger game I’d say the 6mm and wait for perfect shot presentation, but I hope I never have to make that choice.

 

[Daisy]

I will lose this argument if I say my full opinion because I’m not a fan of archery hunting. However if it was choosing a small caliber lead fragmenting bullet vs a heavy arrow with a broadhead for a heart lung shot on a larger animal, I’d choose the bow. It has a precedent of achieving necessary penetration. I think they are losing something of the African experience by doing it, but archery hunters in a blind over water or feed are also waiting for the best shot presentation. That’s not always presented on a spot and stalk hunt with rifle in the brush.

Now If you were to ask me bow or 6mm with monolithic or bonded bullet on larger game I’d say the 6mm and wait for perfect shot presentation, but I hope I never have to make that choice.

Would you admit an arrow hunt on that giraffe would have gone about the same way? Probably one shot. Probably the same length of time until the animal expired, if not longer?

The hunter in the video took 15 animals with all achieving vitals penetration btw.

I’m not a big fan of big game hunting with arrows either. But it seems to not offer the same visceral response. And all those animals run and has a much higher rate of animals lost.

I don’t own a 6mm rifle. I would not take my 223 big game hunting in Africa or on my elk hunt.

 

[375Fox]

Notice argument has gone from is 6mm enough to now attacking the shooters ethics on not shooting enough. Let’s not move the goalpost please

Would you admit an arrow hunt on that giraffe would have gone about the same way? Probably one shot. Probably the same length of time until the animal expired, if not longer?

The hunter in the video took 15 animals with all achieving vitals penetration btw.

I’m not a big fan of big game hunting with arrows either. But it seems to not offer the same visceral response. And all those animals run and has a much higher rate of animals lost.

I don’t own a 6mm rifle. I would not take my 223 big game hunting in Africa or on my elk hunt.

I believe you asked not to move the goal post? I don’t necessarily agree with archery hunting but I generally think the hunters have good intentions and archery is generally not damaging to hunting’s image. I find this to be an unethical target shooting exercise applied to game animals. I’m not going to try and draw parallels.

 

[Daisy]

I believe you asked not to move the goal post? I don’t necessarily agree with archery hunting but I generally think the hunters have good intentions and archery is generally not damaging to hunting’s image. I find this to be an unethical target shooting exercise applied to game animals. I’m not going to try and draw parallels.

That was not at all a relevant deflection. Ha.

If you’re anything, you’re consistent. That is a great trait, up to a point.

Pretty much every video I’ve seen recently that was damaging to hunting ethics has had an arrow sticking out the side of an animal.

 

[WAB]

That was not at all a relevant deflection. Ha.

If you’re anything, you’re consistent. That is a great trait, up to a point.

Pretty much every video I’ve seen recently that was damaging to hunting ethics has had an arrow sticking out the side of an animal.

What is your purpose in this thread? If it is to promote divisiveness and outrage, you are succeeding. I’m wasted far too much time on this thread. If you can’t see it there is no point in further discussion.

 

[Daisy]

What is your purpose in this thread? If it is to promote divisiveness and outrage, you are succeeding. I’m wasted far too much time on this thread. If you can’t see it there is no point in further discussion.

So anything that goes against what you think shouldn’t be discussed? A well known hunter posted that video of an African hunt. Thats not relevant to this board?

Your good ole boys club that only backs the same old same old here is what is dividing and turning people away.

Moderators can shut it down anytime. Please show me where I have been rude to anyone on this thread, or any other.

Then look and see the rudeness shown to me personally on this same thread

 

[Saul]

I wonder what the Venn diagram would look like between those who use the word “harvest” to describe killing an animal and those who do this type of shooting.

 

[Wishfulthinker580]

I wonder what the Venn diagram would look like between those who use the word “harvest” to describe killing an animal and those who do this type of shooting.

The only overlap would probably be the use of a firearm.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I wonder what the Venn diagram would look like between those who use the word “harvest” to describe killing an animal and those who do this type of shooting.

An interesting question. People that use the word "harvest" in lieu of "kill" tend to think that "harvest" is easier for non hunters (or maybe themselves) to digest. Maybe reducing the value of the animal to that of a head of lettuce. Those that do the type of shooting we see on this video are reducing the animal to the status of "target." What's your thinking?

 

[Saul]

An interesting question. People that use the word "harvest" in lieu of "kill" tend to think that "harvest" is easier for non hunters (or maybe themselves) to digest. Maybe reducing the value of the animal to that of a head of lettuce. Those that do the type of shooting we see on this video are reducing the animal to the status of "target." What's your thinking?

I agree with you that both reduce the value of the animal, and that was the point I was trying to make.

 

[Red Leg]

Your good ole boys club that only backs the same old same old here is what is dividing and turning people away.

You are absolutely correct. Your verbal content is so truly free of blame. Who is exactly being driven away?

 

[375Fox]

The shooter and his co hunters have harvested more large game animals than most if not all on this board. 100s of elk, mule deer, black bear, brown bear, sheep, goats, etc.

Africa is not some magical place where animals don’t die. It is proven, yes I say proven, that elk, bear, and other animals can be ethically taken with small caliber rifles with appropriate bullets. 100s and 100s of examples. These guys teach others how to shoot, and have shown time and time again that smaller calibers are shot more proficiently than larger ones.

This trip in the video was to show that the same principals work in Africa. 15 animals (waterbuck, sable, giraffe) were all taken with a 6mmUM with 115gr bullet. They were harvested ethically and in all cases cleanly.

No one here has to change. But the data, yes data, is showing that most would be better served with a smaller cartridge with an appropriate bullet than a larger one.

I think dangerous game is a middle ground but I believe that modern bullets like CEB raptor offer benefit there too.

You’re a reasonable and smart dude 375. I have full confidence you’ll be hunting with a 223 soon!

So anything that goes against what you think shouldn’t be discussed? A well known hunter posted that video of an African hunt. Thats not relevant to this board?

Your good ole boys club that only backs the same old same old here is what is dividing and turning people away.

Moderators can shut it down anytime. Please show me where I have been rude to anyone on this thread, or any other.

Then look and see the rudeness shown to me personally on this same thread

It doesn’t come across that this was posted for a real discussion. It’s comes across that this was posted to help support and create awareness of their agenda. This is the most one sided argument I’ve ever seen on AH, but it covers several continents and a wide age spectrum. It seems to be a very large good ole boys club against this topic.

Have you done their shooting course that you believe their theories so strongly?

 

[CBH Australia]

An interesting question. People that use the word "harvest" in lieu of "kill" tend to think that "harvest" is easier for non hunters (or maybe themselves) to digest. Maybe reducing the value of the animal to that of a head of lettuce. Those that do the type of shooting we see on this video are reducing the animal to the status of "target." What's your thinking?

I think there is more nutritional value in an animal than in a head of lettuce.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I agree with you that both reduce the value of the animal, and that was the point I was trying to make.

And I think you"re right.

 

[cajunchefray]

Would you admit an arrow hunt on that giraffe would have gone about the same way? Probably one shot. Probably the same length of time until the animal expired, if not longer?

The hunter in the video took 15 animals with all achieving vitals penetration btw.

I’m not a big fan of big game hunting with arrows either. But it seems to not offer the same visceral response. And all those animals run and has a much higher rate of animals lost.

I don’t own a 6mm rifle. I would not take my 223 big game hunting in Africa or on my elk hunt.

"Taking" 15 animals means nothing in regard to Humane hunting of 15 animals.

How does one define the difference?

Probably the discussion, amongst true hunters.

 

[Doug Hamilton]

I think there is more nutritional value in an animal than in a head of lettuce.

Obviously.