What is the max range of shotgun slugs?

[rookhawk]

rookhawk,
Great points and I get what you are saying and basically agree but mine has held its accuracy after possibly 400-500 shots as long as I throughly scrub the barrel after every 50 shots or so. Sabot plastic fouling will destroy accuracy. I agree wholeheartedly that the gun was made cheaply but with the laminate stock and heavy barrel it has performed admirably for me and lock up is still as tight as the day I got it. Mine is a 12g but friends have has simiar experiences with the 20g. If it had only lasted me 5 seasons I would have gotten my money's worth but I have probably had it for 15 years now (not sure exactly) and am very happy with the performance. I agree with the scope points too. Mine wears a standard 3x9 but my shots are never past 125 or so and usually under 75. $800??? Really?

Sorry. 12 bore is about $350, 20 bore is $800. The 20-bore is more accurate at distances where you need a saboted bullet. Both of these being the "Ultimate" models that had the 26"ish barrels, not the youth models with shorter barrels.

 

[rookhawk]

I have an old leupold vx3 plain Jane scope on it (no whiz bang whirrley magical thingy). Sighted in at 150 it does really well from 0-175 yds without much thinking of hold over.

@Wahoo for $50 Kenton Industries will burn a turret for your vx3 on that backup slug rifle. The only data you'd need to know that you don't possess is the actual velocity. The 24" barrels I use with 3" accutips create real-world 1775fps so you could probably just measure and subtract 25-50fps (25fps per inch) and you'd have all the data you need. It would probably extended the practical use of the slug rifle by another 60 yards, especially if someone using it gets confused by the concept of hold-overs.

 

[Ridge Runner]

500 fps (a Crossman 760 bb gun tops that!) LOL 500 yds no bueno w/ shotgun. 1,000 ft-lbs E. 3rd sentence don't understand. LOL (What is the bullet mfr's min suggested V to effectively penetrate the animal and have the bullet do its job? A: Not what someone randomly says on an internet forum.) Consult Tesla CEO for the answer to the last! Something about a trajectory worse than a longbow?

The 1 ounce slug has a muzzle velocity is 1885 feet per second.

The 1 ounce slug has 300 plus foot pounds of knock down energy at 500 yards. Which is 1.5 - 3 times the body weight of a white tail deer. Which is enough energy to penetrate the kill zone and kill a white tail deer.

It's not what someone says on the internet.

It's properly entering the below information into a ballistic calculator.

It's using a chronograph to check velocity.
The slug (bullet) weight,
The slug (bullet) Ballistic Coefficient,
The sight height,
Wind speed
Wind angle/direction
Zero range

Chart Interval
Chart Range

Calculate Chart

I primarily use the Hornady Ballistic Calculator.

Seems trajectory bothers you. Zero at 25 yards, Don't shoot anything over 25 yards, you won't have to be worry so much about bullet/slug/arrow trajectories.

 

[C.W. Richter]

Without checking ballistics with a fine-toothed comb at this hr after working 2 shifts for weeks, I'm not buying the effectiveness of humane kills by 12 ga slug at 500 yds. LOL smh Are you seriously comparing ft-lbs of E to the weight of the object struck? It's the amount of Energy that it takes to drive a ballistic through the body sufficiently to make a quick kill. Most mfrs like to see at least 1,000 ft-lbs for proper penetration, expansion, damage, humane kills, etc. It's not a marketing thing. Otherwise they'd say 1 ft-lb will do'er! LOL That thing has .22 E at 500 with a large frontal area, large diameter, ultra-low SD lead slug (that takes considerable V and E to work). It's far from ideal. Why no one does that. I mean people drove AMC Pacers and Gremlins, but we're still not sure why (was it the price?) LOL Good luck with that and please post your 500 yd practice targets and kills for all of us to peruse...What you are contemplating isn't much different than taking pot shots with a 470-600 cal shooting 1,800 fps MVs (although they have better quality bullets and SDs.) Anyone downing game with their doubles at 500?

 

[C.W. Richter]

From 1 mfr.: A 12 gauge slug of one-ounce weight fired from a standard Federal cartridge will shoot over 300 yards. The ballistics are flat for around 200 yards and at the 300-yard mark the slug has dropped 4 feet. At 300 yards the slug is still lethal and penetrates ¾ inch plywood. I'll say 1/2 your desired range, due to very poor trajectory. I've seen some DG shot w/ 20 ga (they penetrate better as the smaller diam slugs/sabots have better SDs). At 500-480=20 yds. LOL My son shot a nice bear w/ a 20 ga-it did NOT penetrate well at the angle presented (60 yds) and it was a long track with a follow-up shot required before it was down. (He then put his shotgun away forever in favor of the 7, 300 or 375, as far as big game is concerned.)

 

[rookhawk]

Many people have differing opinions on penetration and minimum KE for deer sized animals, but I’d like to see more than 500ft lbs of energy in a small bore bullet. 700-800 ft lbs in a saboted 20 gauge slug (really a 40 cal bullet), and if we’re shooting a 12 gauge bore-riding slug, you better have 1000 ft lbs of energy upon impact because the frontal area does not want to penetrate and if it hits ribs or shoulder, that big piece of soft lead is going to expand quickly and come to a screeching halt.

YMMV.

With my opinion above which certainly is not merely my own, it puts you at around a 330 yard theoretical max for a 3” saboted 20 gauge slug and probably about 230 yards for a 12 bore bore-riding lightfield slug. Naturally, real-world shooting distances will be less than that as accuracy depletes even faster than energy.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Without checking ballistics with a fine-toothed comb at this hr after working 2 shifts for weeks, I'm not buying the effectiveness of humane kills by 12 ga slug at 500 yds. LOL smh Are you seriously comparing ft-lbs of E to the weight of the object struck? It's the amount of Energy that it takes to drive a ballistic through the body sufficiently to make a quick kill. Most mfrs like to see at least 1,000 ft-lbs for proper penetration, expansion, damage, humane kills, etc. It's not a marketing thing. Otherwise they'd say 1 ft-lb will do'er! LOL That thing has .22 E at 500 with a large frontal area, large diameter, ultra-low SD lead slug (that takes considerable V and E to work). It's far from ideal. Why no one does that. I mean people drove AMC Pacers and Gremlins, but we're still not sure why (was it the price?) LOL Good luck with that and please post your 500 yd practice targets and kills for all of us to peruse...What you are contemplating isn't much different than taking pot shots with a 470-600 cal shooting 1,800 fps MVs (although they have better quality bullets and SDs.) Anyone downing game with their doubles at 500?

What gauge is your slug gun?
What is your slug gun barrel length?
What type of slug/sabot do you use?
What is the velocity of your slug/sabot?

1000 foot pounds of energy is not needed for deer or many other medium skin animals.

"....... Most mfrs like to see at least 1,000 ft-lbs for proper penetration, expansion, damage, humane kills, etc. ......."

I'm curious to know the name of these manufacturers.

"Are you seriously comparing ft-lbs of E to the weight of the object struck? "

Short answer: Yes!

This was a topic I either originally posted 3?, maybe 4? years ago or was in response to another member's original post relating to enough energy for a humane kill.

 

[Forrest Halley]

The firing pins are a known aggrevation and we’ve replaced them in these with custom ones machines by a friend because they weren’t hardened correctly and would deform/shorten over time.

Interesting thing about the accutips is if you take a box of them and press the slug down into the shell/sabot generally there is some movement. We have found that ensuring you seat them into the shell as hard as your thumb allows without crying it will often eliminate the random flyer in a group. I haven’t seen anything but accutips where this is a thing.

I learned a great deal from these two paragraphs. Explains why I can't shoot federal shells in my 20ga. Also explains why the third shot is consistently a flier in my 695. Thank you.

The thing I have always hated about slug guns and the whole regulation of it is that it makes no sense to me. In some places I cannot use a rifle, but this chunk of less than accurate lead is some how either considered safer or more humane than buckshot or a rifle. The Tarhunt people are very smart about the slugs and their limits. I cannot stomach the price of a dedicated slug rifle which at that point it merely a technicality between it and the straight walled rifle. I have played the development game with both buckshot and slugs. Why not just shoot a .45-70 at that point?

As far as the minimum ft-lbs of ME that is required for big game here in Virginia it is 350 ft-lbs in a handgun. With all the modern innovations and weird calibers coming out there is a good possibility of a .32 being a deer gun for some cavalier explorer. I don't have a long documented history of the ballistics needed to humanely kill deer, but I have found that the answer is in energy transfer. Not specifically muzzle velocity or even muzzle energy, but what can you transfer into the animal. I've killed deer with a .458 Lott, .45-70, .300 WM, .30-06, 9mm, .45ACP, 12 gauge in all three common lengths, and 20 gauge in both common lengths. What I found was that fast is great, but slow is reliable. Fast projectiles are great when they hit exactly right and zip right on through a vital area. I've never seen a fast round knock anything down or cause pause on a bad hit though. Big slow bullets transfer energy better into the animal and for better or worse placement it gives a chance to stack a shot on top of that first one. I'm all for less tracking and you're getting that with effective energy transfer.

 

[Foxi]

I am not sure about maximum range as I am more interested in effective range of a weapon system with all things considered (gun, cartridge, sighting system, rest, me, etc.). I have a rifled and scoped slug barrel on an 870 that shoots 2-3" groups out to 150 yards which is as far as I would care to use it. Based on numerous loads and accuracy tests, I would not shoot a slug at an animal past 25 yards with my Krieghoff dreiling.

Safe shooting

Ranger!
Your restraint honors you.
But on 50 m you can certainly shoot with it. Provided that the barrels do not shoot in opposite directions.
Here is a picture from my 100 years old Sauer+Sohn Drilling 16ga.
50m over a stick.
On the left with Scope.On the right Open sight.
Just normal Brennecke slugs.

Gents,if your deer shoots at 100m ,does that go over open sight ?

Love this thread and your experiences

 

[Hunter-Habib]

Based on the few times I've used Brenneke Black Magic slugs on game, I'd say that my longest shot was at 80 yards. That was on a forest boar, with the modified choke lower barrel of a Valmet Model 412 over/under.

 

[rookhawk]

Based on the few times I've used Brenneke Black Magic slugs on game, I'd say that my longest shot was at 80 yards. That was on a forest boar, with the modified choke lower barrel of a Valmet Model 412 over/under.

For choked smoothbores, particularly drillings, I’ve found nothing better than brenneke slugs.

 

[Bob Nelson 35Whelen]

With pumpkin balls 75-100 yards with good sights or scope. Sabots and rifled barrels 150- 200 yards anything beyond that is real iffy. The main impediment to people shooting more practice is recoil aversion not expense.

@NS 9X56
I can assure you a 12 gauge 3" magnum 1 and 1/4 ounce slug at 1,600 fps out of a 6.5# Mossberg bolt gun gets your attention very smartly.
Mine with a Bushnell TRS25 red dot does about 2" at 50 yards for 3 shots. More than enough off the bench thank you.
Bob