Your favorite new production double rifle manufacturer?

[matt85]

That is clearly a valid point...you need all the velocity you can get from the .577/.600..

I testfired a .600 with new Kynoch that is SUPPOSED to duplicate the .600-110-900 load, but alas, we had no chrono there and then so I never got to check it out, rifle barrel was 24" BTW..

our member @buckstix has a VC 600 NE with 24" barrels and he performed this very test using Kynoch ammunition. the results were 1885fps with the Kynoch ammunition loaded with 900gr Woodleigh FMJ. this is much too slow, meaning either the Kynoch ammunition is light loaded or the 24" barrel isnt able to bring out the full speed of standard NE loads.

-matt

 

[Pondoro]

Perhaps the current Kynoch is loaded close to the true velocity of the older ammo....the claimed 1950 fps was from 28" barrels or maybe it was just exaggerated...

At least the 900 grain Woodie is a much better bullet than the old (useless) solids that Kynoch loaded up to the end of production..

 

[fsrmg1]

Give me a Beretta 689 Silver Sable anytime. Fits like a glove for fast action shooting with either the rifle barrels on, or the shotgun set. The rifle is also surprisingly accurate and well regulated, making shots out to 250m-300m possible with confidence.

Now I just wish that they made it in a larger caliber. The 405 Win would be ideal for her to keep her slim and trim lines.

 

[matt85]

Perhaps the current Kynoch is loaded close to the true velocity of the older ammo....the claimed 1950 fps was from 28" barrels or maybe it was just exaggerated.

thinking about it, im betting the Kynoch load is correct. if its getting 1885fps from a 24" barrel then i would expect around 2000fps with a 28" barrel. getting another 30fps per inch of barrel is hardly unheard of.
at any rate, we have gotten off topic (although i do love this kind of topic).

personally ive been looking very hard at Heym and Verney Carron. both build outstanding firearms but i think VC might offer more bang for your buck then Heym.

-matt

 

[49cub]

For me it depends on caliber.

When I can finally convince my wife I'll get a Verney-Carron 577 nitro express. I like the looks and price of their big doubles. I'm pretty plain on engraving so I like it kind of minimalist.

9.3x74R I really like the Chapuis. Price again is a big pushing point for me on these. Plus the fact that they reported to be very accurate. I really like the sculpted lines and slimness of their actions as well.

470-500 I'd take another Blaser s2 like I currently have. I bought it over a merkel because I got a better deal. Working with it I really, really like it. I know a lot of people don't like the push to cock feature but I think it's great. Quick to arm and quickly and quietly can be made safe again. It's a slightly heavy double that I enjoy because it makes plinking more fun with it. It also has extractors that I prefer since I'm rolling my own. I can empty the chambers and reload by dumping it fairly quick.

 

[AZDAVE]

If I had seen this topic it might have saved me some $$$. But then I would have missed out on some fun. Well my introduction to double rifles was first in the printed word. Then I attended a big bore shoot (40 cal and up) put on by our local gun store I showed up with a 458WM and one of the member showed up with a Merkel 500NE. Those first left and right and I was hooked. My first double was one of the Remington russian made 221's in 45/70, crude, rough and was fun to shoot and learned about regulation and loading for a double. traded it and bought a Sabatti 45/70 (Non dremmeled) shot to regulation and was a 1000% improvement over the REM. Sold it to a friend that had to have it. Saved for a while and bought/traded for a Sabatti in 450NE, (used on two safaris for warthog, Zebra and Cape Buffalo) at the same time bought a chapuis 9.3x74R (used for one safari so far Cape Eland and Sable). Traded for a 405win double of german origin between the wars. (Company no longer in business). Bought a english woodward 500BPE (also not in business) just traded it and some $$ for a Verney-Carron 450/400 O/U that I haven't been able to get to the range with yet so will comment on itt more after a couple range session. First impressions is that it is very well balanced and come to the shoulder like a fine shotgun. My friends Merkel is well balanced and shoot very well and would make a fine rifle for anyone at a reasonable price for a intro double rifle. My Sabatti's have been good, not as refined as the Chapuis or VC but if you get one that is very well regulated you have a bargain double that will serve you well. My Chapuis is just plain flat out shoot's, I like the balance and would be willing to hunt most anything on the planet with a 300ge Aframe in the right barrel and a Northfolk cupped solid in the left. (Might light for Elephant but with the right PH for backup would give it a whirl) It handles like a nice shootgun and fits me well. I have handled a Blaser(didn't like its balance), Hyme and Krigenhof but never shot one. My first choice is my Chapuis and then the 405win. Jury out on the VC till I get it to the range.

 

[Bullhunter]

Heym box lock.
Under 20 thousand US dollars new, sometimes slightly under 15 (occasionaly with promotional sale pricing).
Reliable, accurate, robust internal parts of today's modern steel, yet externally highly resembles classic rifles from 100 years ago.
Intercepting sears.

Available in .375 H&H (and flanged either one) .450/.400 3", .450 NE and .500 NE - some of my favorites, (especially the .450/.400 3".)
26" ejector barrels seem to be standard or at least very common.
Articulated front trigger.
Their standard engraving is sparse and tasteful/real engraving, not cast or stamped or lazered.

If you want to go over the 20K price and get a side lock with game scene engraving, Heym's Engraver/s seem to cut their animals to actually look like 3D African wildlife.
Unlike some other makers, who's animals not only just look flat but they each and every one all look like a flat Labrador retriever, with a flat buffalo horn boss or flat lion mane or flat rhino horn, etc.
(Perhaps Napoleon Dynamite is doing their engraving?).

I also like both Verney Carron and Chapuise because they are most of the above things mentioned about the Heym but definitely not as classic looking externally.
They are a little less money than the Heym though.
However, for my taste, I'd rather save up for a couple extra years and just get the Heym or, find a barely used Heym at a reasonable price (as I did).

If 26" ejector barrels were a standard feature/option on Merkel doubles, I might have considered another one (my first double rifle was a Merkel).
But their short barrels put me off a bit (as does their engraving).

It is a shame none of the above (or for that matter any I can think of) offer an affordable double in .303 Brittish with 26" barrels.

If I was rich, I'd only want Westley Richards drop lock doubles but alas, I shall never be rich.

Everything is posted in that.
And true.

Try a Heym, it is the best double you can buy for an "normal price" and you get an perfect quality.

I was often in the factory and I had seen the professionalism and the handmade working process.
Great!

 

[Bullhunter]

Barrel Lengh

You can get what you want, from 20 - 30 inch.
Because every double is custom, is unique.

If you dont ask or if you order the standart version:
In the beginning of the best-known Heym modell 88 double (box- or sidelock), they made 25 inches (this was in the 80thys and 90thys), then they go for 24 (in the time of the millenium and some years later), now (the last 3 - 4 years) they made mostly 26 inch.


Amo

Heym regulated the double with the amo you want.
Hornady, Kynoch or Norma PH series or...
If you are an handloader, they have some solutions too.

 

[markferrigno]

I 2nd Heym. I have been the factory several times, spoke with the folks who work there and who run the company. Amazing quality. They will regulate with the ammo you chose. I have several O/U and Drillings (no DG calibers) and they all shoo amazingly well.

 

[Philip Glass]

I looked at them all and for me for under $20K the Kreighoff was my choice. I felt good as far as fit and balance. It was near the lower end of what I was looking at. I've shot a Heym and it had firing pin problems.mim sure they fixed it but problems none the less.
I'm spending the money on the safaris instead of the guns at this point. I'm hunting with my Rugers for now.
Regards
Philip

 

[Bullhunter]

This is an great Heym double.
The brand-new 150 years aniv. modell, for "only" 120.000 euros.

 

[Pondoro]

I also like both Verney Carron and Chapuise because they are most of the above things mentioned about the Heym but definitely not as classic looking externally.

Hmmm...have you handeled the round-action Verney- Carron DRs...?

I think they are at least as classic looking (aka the old british doubles) as the Heyms..

That said, Heym make very good double rifles..

 

[Brett Becker]

From what others have commented on, it appears to me and I totally agree, fit ,balance and reliability are far more important than engraving and brand names.

I have had a Sabatti in 450/400 which was free from modification with a Dremel and as others have stated , if you get a good one they shoot fine but if you were unlucky like I was it wasn't even close to being regulated.

I am currently on my second Merkel in the same caliber as above, the first was also poorly regulated . So brand names aren't always the answer.

To me , fit and function is more important. I have even gone as far as fitting an adjustable comb to the current Merkel ( I know I have committed a sin by doing so ) but it now points and shoots like a dream

 

[Witold Krzyżanowski]

Holland & Holland in 450/400Jeffery.
Witold

 

[matt85]

Holland & Holland in 450/400Jeffery.
Witold

on that note, I was really unimpressed with H&H at the recent SCI show in Las Vegas. the rifles they had on display were dirty (very dusty with filthy bores) and the staff did a fine job of ignoring me until I demanded attention and then they were rude. if your going to sell $100,000+ rifles you need to have outstanding customer service!

nothing against your choice in rifles, you just reminded me of the experience.

-matt

 

[spike.t]

on that note, I was really unimpressed with H&H at the recent SCI show in Las Vegas. the rifles they had on display were dirty (very dusty with filthy bores) and the staff did a fine job of ignoring me until I demanded attention and then they were rude. if your going to sell $100,000+ rifles you need to have outstanding customer service!

nothing against your choice in rifles, you just reminded me of the experience.

-matt

yeah but @matt85 i had warned them to be on the look out for you......

 

[matt85]

yeah but @matt85 i had warned them to be on the look out for you......

they were probably pissed off cause you told them their guns were too expensive! i would love to see you talk with the H&H guys after a couple cocktails... not sure they could handle it though.

-matt

 

[Nyati]

Heym 88B PH in .470NE, no frills very well made gun.

 

[zephyr]

Come to think of it, a Westley Richards gold name model in .577 or .600 should be nice...a no frills working rifle made for elephant hunting....not a life as a safe-queen..

Here is one at Champlin Arms
http://www.champlinarms.com/Default.aspx?tabid=30&ctl=GunsDetails&mid=409&StyleID=3&GunID=2385

 

[Albert GRANT]

I suppose I don't even belong on this one but it is funny to read to me. I can't afford a $20k car, much less a rifle. My entire upcoming africa trip is 1/4 of that!