Running a double rifle

[Jfet]

Over the last 3 pages we have determined the proper ammunition, sighted in the rife, and have taken it hunting. Now it’s time to clean the double rifle. What are areas of a double rifle to pay attention to that are not found in a magazine rifle?

 

[One Day...]

I know you are chatting with @One Day... at the moment, but there are those of us who strongly believe taking two rifles at all is overthinking the problem.

If your double .375 is scoped and truly accurate (always a bit of an if), then it will handle virtually any requirement you might stumble upon while hunting your buffalo. Assuming you have days remaining for focused PG (I have always had plenty of time to hunt PG as well) then bring the other set of barrels if you are so inclined. I did exactly that with my S2 and its .375 and 30-06 barrels.

We are definitely all chatting together and my Friend Red Leg's opinion is ALWAYS welcome and relevant, and I mean it

This is especially true with this post because I agree 100% with him (except that I still bring 2 rifles when he always brings one).

In my case:

• Krieghoff double .470 NE with red dot sighted at 25/50 yards.
• Blaser R8 with (now) either scoped .375 H&H barrel (Lion & Leopard) sighted at 100 yard with BDC (Bullet Drop Compensation) turret, or scoped .458 Lott barrel (Elephant, Hippo on land, Buffalo) sighted at 150 yards (+0.5" @ 50 yards / +1.5" @ 100 yards / 0" @ 150 yards / -4" @ 200 yards).

I carry a short range "stopper." The scoped bolt action truly serves a purpose the big-bore double cannot: any shot at PG out to 200 yards; any low visibility difficult shot at 50 yards in long grass or dense jesse at DG; and the rare 100 yards shot at DG in unusual circumstances.

In your case:

• Heym scoped double .375 H&H 350 gr sighted likely at 50/100 yards (0" @ 50 yards / 0" @ 100 yards / -6" @ 200 yards).
• Mauser 03 .300 Win Mag 180 gr I presume, sighted likely at 300 yards (+3.5" @ 100 yards / +4.4" @ 200 yards / 0" @ 300 yards).

In "this last part in the day, only a hour or two before dusk, no more chance to see any elephant that day" when you "could be convinced to pull the trigger on a 200m monster bushbuck that has my PH's cheeks flushed" whether you have the .375 double (assuming that it groups) or the .300 bolt action, you will need to either hold a few inches up or a few inches down to connect cleanly, and the bushbuck will never know the difference.

In so many words, you do not carry a short range "stopper" but a mid range "killer" and your scoped mid-bore double can already do what I ask a tracker to carry the scoped bolt action for: any shot at PG out to 200 yards; any low visibility difficult shot at 50 yards in long grass or dense jesse at DG; and the rare 100 yards shot at DG in unusual circumstances.

So, indeed, as Red Leg says, if your double .375 barrels group, I am not sure what purpose the second rifle serves, unless you want a purely mechanical backup, in which case you would have the .375 H&H barrel on the Mauser 03 too.

And if the 7x65R barrels group, as discussed previously out to 300 yards the .300 will not do much the 7x65R cannot do...

Ergo: is the Mauser 03 for sale?

PS: That's OK, I have already sold one of my beloved CZ550 now that I have the Blaser

As to cleaning, pull a BoreSnake through the barrel 3 times (being careful not to rub the cord against the edge of the crown) every time you go in the field, whether you shoot or not (dust accumulating inside the barrel is abrasive when the bullet forces it way through...) and do not worry about anything, unless you live in a high humidity environment where a lightly oiled patch will do wonders for long term storage.

 

[Tanks]

I think that this is a diminishing concern. Maybe it still applies in 21 days full bag safaris in Tanzania, but the reality nowadays in most of Africa, is that you will not have in your pocket a Buff (never mind Lion or Elephant) license if you are hunting PG, and, conversely, you will likely not want to empty the block with a shot and compromise your chances at Lion, Elephant or even Buffalo on a 5 or 10 days hunt, unless (even if?) you happen to bump into the next world-record three toed unicorn...

...

In the areas I have hunted in Zim the stalk occurs after a drive. On the way if I see a trophy PG, then I will take it.

On my upcoming 14 day hunt in Nyakasanga my main quarry is elephant and a buffalo though I also paid a deposit for a zebra license. If I see a good Kudu I will also take it.

However, if we are tracking an elephant or a buffalo I will leave the PG rifle (either a .300 RUM bolt or 9.3x74R double both with BDC turrets) in the truck and take the .500 NE.

Of course, once the DG animals are in the salt then the PG rifle will be the one in the truck. The Zambia hunt after Zimbabwe is PG only, so the .500 NE will stay in the case.

 

[Kevin Peacocke]

In the areas I have hunted in Zim the stalk occurs after a drive. On the way if I see a trophy PG, then I will take it.

On my upcoming 14 day hunt in Nyakasanga my main quarry is elephant and a buffalo though I also paid a deposit for a zebra license. If I see a good Kudu I will also take it.

However, if we are tracking an elephant or a buffalo I will leave the PG rifle (either a .300 RUM bolt or 9.3x74R double both with BDC turrets) in the truck and take the .500 NE.

Of course, once the DG animals are in the salt then the PG rifle will be the one in the truck. The Zambia hunt after Zimbabwe is PG only, so the .500 NE will stay in the case.

A double rifle African safari sounds so correct. I am hoping to do all of this with my upcomming 450/400. I wont be taking an elephant so in my case it is a buffalo and PG blend, open sights and red dot. On our recent Save foray I imagined this was the case and we got to within iron sights range on everything but eland, and that included elephant, buffalo, zebra, kudu, impala, blue wildebeest, warthog and nyala. The eland were off asross a pan, a herd of maybe ten with a massive gray bull amongst them.

 

[rookhawk]

Over the last 3 pages we have determined the proper ammunition, sighted in the rife, and have taken it hunting. Now it’s time to clean the double rifle. What are areas of a double rifle to pay attention to that are not found in a magazine rifle?

Good question. What I’ve learned with monometal solids is they are like glue to the rifling. It takes me about an hour to remove 5 rounds of brass from my .470NE barrels. Definitely wipe-out foam and hoppes #9 super-elite-whatever-its-called foam. Lots of foam. Plastic bristled brushes. Lots of elbow grease. That’s probably the biggest thing for keeping a double rifle clean. For the action and exterior metal, Kroil is a wonderful product. For the wood, wax paste, bowling alley paste, or renaissance wax keeps the wood sealed and waterproof. For the checkering, a soft toothbrush and a bit of dawn dish soap every so often. For restoring the wood, a drop of oil on the hand, every other day for Six days is enough to keep the finish built up every year. I like to put kroil in the rib of the barrels too in order to ensure that if there is a microscopic pore and thus rust can grow under the ribs, the kroil can get there and arrest it.

 

[VertigoBE]

I might just have had a brilliant idea... or not at all of course, I leave that to your discerning opinion. I was looking on gunfinder (a german online marketplace for new and used firearms) looking for such a Heym sxs, getting nothing. Also I have never seen a sxs with a cheek piece, in the weight category of a double.

But what I can find, probably quite cheap, are older drillings... Would a drilling with sxs shotgun barrels in 20ga or 12ga, with a single rifle barrel below it not be a perfect candidate as a "double rifle practice gun"? The weight will be up, a lot of them have a cheek piece, usually their low value is due to a bad rifle barrel, while the shotgun barrels are likely to be more than fine for a few thousand more rounds. They might even have extractors ??

View attachment 438147

this is a Merkel Suhl drilling with sxs 12/70 ga shotgun barrels and an underslung 7x65r rifle barrel, double trigger, cheek piece, the works. For the formidable price of 398EUR (around 460USD). I will not buy this exact one of course, I do not want to do the whole import business for a 400 Euro rifle, too much headache, but it is a nice example perhaps of an alternative to a sxs shotgun?

What do you think?

What do you think @rookhawk, was this brilliant or not quite?

 

[rookhawk]

What do you think @rookhawk, was this brilliant or not quite?

you certainly can get a drilling. The short barrel and cheek piece will simulate a double. But not a 12 gauge, a 16 or 20 gauge will have a similar action size to the double.

you may find that you don’t need one though. For the same price, you could shoot the barrels out of the 7x65r heym on running boar. Then go to Africa with the 375 and you’ll be plenty confident.

next gun you buy should be a heym 470 with a set of 20 gauge barrels, then engraved to match your existing. You’d then literally have every gun you need for your lifetime.

 

[DieJager]

I might just have had a brilliant idea... or not at all of course, I leave that to your discerning opinion. I was looking on gunfinder (a german online marketplace for new and used firearms) looking for such a Heym sxs, getting nothing. Also I have never seen a sxs with a cheek piece, in the weight category of a double.

But what I can find, probably quite cheap, are older drillings... Would a drilling with sxs shotgun barrels in 20ga or 12ga, with a single rifle barrel below it not be a perfect candidate as a "double rifle practice gun"? The weight will be up, a lot of them have a cheek piece, usually their low value is due to a bad rifle barrel, while the shotgun barrels are likely to be more than fine for a few thousand more rounds. They might even have extractors ??

View attachment 438147

this is a Merkel Suhl drilling with sxs 12/70 ga shotgun barrels and an underslung 7x65r rifle barrel, double trigger, cheek piece, the works. For the formidable price of 398EUR (around 460USD). I will not buy this exact one of course, I do not want to do the whole import business for a 400 Euro rifle, too much headache, but it is a nice example perhaps of an alternative to a sxs shotgun?

What do you think?

The import from Germany is not quite the headache you think. They export a lot. Bought my 375 from that site. Send some papers, filled in a couple and drove to pickup my gun. The export costs are usually mentioned per country

 

[VertigoBE]

We are definitely all chatting together and my Friend Red Leg's opinion is ALWAYS welcome and relevant, and I mean it

This is especially true with this post because I agree 100% with him (except that I still bring 2 rifles when he always brings one).

In my case:

• Krieghoff double .470 NE with red dot sighted at 25/50 yards.
• Blaser R8 with (now) either scoped .375 H&H barrel (Lion & Leopard) sighted at 100 yard with BDC (Bullet Drop Compensation) turret, or scoped .458 Lott barrel (Elephant, Hippo on land, Buffalo) sighted at 150 yards (+0.5" @ 50 yards / +1.5" @ 100 yards / 0" @ 150 yards / -4" @ 200 yards).

I carry a short range "stopper." The scoped bolt action truly serves a purpose the big-bore double cannot: any shot at PG out to 200 yards; any low visibility difficult shot at 50 yards in long grass or dense jesse at DG; and the rare 100 yards shot at DG in unusual circumstances.

In your case:

• Heym scoped double .375 H&H 350 gr sighted likely at 50/100 yards (0" @ 50 yards / 0" @ 100 yards / -6" @ 200 yards).
• Mauser 03 .300 Win Mag 180 gr I presume, sighted likely at 300 yards (+3.5" @ 100 yards / +4.4" @ 200 yards / 0" @ 300 yards).

In "this last part in the day, only a hour or two before dusk, no more chance to see any elephant that day" when you "could be convinced to pull the trigger on a 200m monster bushbuck that has my PH's cheeks flushed" whether you have the .375 double (assuming that it groups) or the .300 bolt action, you will need to either hold a few inches up or a few inches down to connect cleanly, and the bushbuck will never know the difference.

In so many words, you do not carry a short range "stopper" but a mid range "killer" and your scoped mid-bore double can already do what I ask a tracker to carry the scoped bolt action for: any shot at PG out to 200 yards; any low visibility difficult shot at 50 yards in long grass or dense jesse at DG; and the rare 100 yards shot at DG in unusual circumstances.

So, indeed, as Red Leg says, if your double .375 barrels group, I am not sure what purpose the second rifle serves, unless you want a purely mechanical backup, in which case you would have the .375 H&H barrel on the Mauser 03 too.

And if the 7x65R barrels group, as discussed previously out to 300 yards the .300 will not do much the 7x65R cannot do...

Ergo: is the Mauser 03 for sale?

PS: That's OK, I have already sold one of my beloved CZ550 now that I have the Blaser

As to cleaning, pull a BoreSnake through the barrel 3 times (being careful not to rub the cord against the edge of the crown) every time you go in the field, whether you shoot or not (dust accumulating inside the barrel is abrasive when the bullet forces it way through...) and do not worry about anything, unless you live in a high humidity environment where a lightly oiled patch will do wonders for long term storage.

Okay okay, I'll take the two Heym barrelsets

Perhaps between the ".470 or 500 broadsword" and the ".300 or 7x65r rapier", the .375H&H should then the "sabre" category?

However my M03 will never be for sale, this is the first rifle I ever bought! It represents my beginnings in hunting. I am keeping this rifle with me, I even put some lipstick on it!

thanks for the tip on the daily cleaning during the safari ! Had not thought about the maintenance when abroad.

 

[Tanks]

@VertigoBE After all things said, I think one might be overthinking getting used to the double rifles. Just shoot the darn rifle maybe a couple of hundred times, practice mounting it and practice double triggers some with a SxS shotgun.

It is not rocket science. I fired my .500 NE three times in the field last year, once at buffalo and twice at elephant.

 

[One Day...]

Agreed, but with one notorious exception, which might be the one rare case when the double is most useful: defensive shooting on close range moving target.

Admittedly, it is extremely rare (or at least it should be), and even rarer for clients (many PHs prefer not to have to worry about an armed client close-by in such cases - the client's loaded rifle can be more dangerous than the critter...) but still it remains THE argument in favor of the double, hence I see a rationale for being reasonably proficient at it.

It is somewhat similar to shotgunning: it does not take much practice to line up a standing or slowly walking turkey; it is a whole different matter to break consistently clay from the skeet low house - and the target is not even flying toward you...

So, if double rifle gunnery is limited to shooting off the sticks at standing animals, it is one thing, but if it may involve braining a charging Buff or Elephant, or breasting a charging Lion, it is another...

Some will say that it virtually never happens, yet virtually every year a PH gets killed exactly like that. Without confusing role with that of a PH, and without exaggerating the very limited chances of this happening, I for one prefer to have practiced for it...

Some will also say that it is not the client's job, in which case, honestly, the client is better served, under any real-world circumstance, by a scoped bolt action

So........ what are we buying doubles for?

• Nostalgia and tag-along client role? A few rounds per year is indeed plenty enough.
• Potentially - repeat: POTENTIALLY - using them for what they were designed? Whole different matter.............

Practicing off hand in front of the TV when watching safari videos is certainly extremely valuable -- really, it is truly worth doing -- but it may also build the wrong expectation. Placing shot #2 after "boom" will be way different from after "click"

 

[Tanks]

Agreed, but with one notorious exception, which might be the one rare case when the double is most useful: defensive instinctive shooting on close range moving target.

...

So, if double rifle gunnery is limited to shooting off the sticks at standing animals it is one thing, if it may involve braining a charging Buff or Elephant, or breasting a charging Lion, it is another...

That is what practicing mounting the rifle and dry firing is all about. Additionally, just because one is using a double does not mean one's regular rifle skills go out the window.

Now, to be honest, most of my practice with the .500 NE has been offhand. I am a big believer in the hasty sling and to me at under 50 yards it is just as stable as sticks except one has more feel for their rifle.

 

[spike.t]

My S2's shoot parallel (as in not crossing) MOA shots from each barrel at 100 meters and under 2.5 inch four-shot groups with all three sets of barrels. My two favorite 9.3's do the same thing. I can sight between the shots and turn it into 3 - 3.5 MOA rifle at 100 yards, or I can sight in on the first barrel and have a MOA capable rifle out to the effective range of the caliber with a second shot within a couple of MOA at that range. Inside 125 - 150 it will do exactly the same thing as the center sighted rifle. Doing the former strikes me as being somewhat willfully limiting, while the latter seems a good way to take advantage of the full range of a cartridge rather than "desperate."

I have a .470 that I use in the "traditional" manner with open sights and it is logical to use it in the traditional way and achieve combined groups on the sight.

But treating a modern accurate double like a stopping rifle is being a Luddite. Scope it with a detachable scope; take full advantage of first round accuracy; and remain assured it will do anything inside 125 yards a center of group sighted double will do. A no brainer. A technique I have proven to my satisfaction on game large and small, close and far, in Africa.

And I never use solids on buffalo any longer under any conditions. I would suspect the vast majority of PH's now also subscribe to a magazine or two barrels loaded with premium SP's.

Don't you get bored?....

 

[Red Leg]

Don't you get bored?....

Pretty funny.

Maybe tired ......... Think I'll buy myself a drink. I'm doing Hendrick's and tonic this afternoon.

 

[spike.t]

Pretty funny.

Maybe tired ......... Think I'll buy myself a drink. I'm doing Hendrick's and tonic this afternoon.

Nice

 

[Forrest Halley]

I think the costs involved in running a double rifle means that very few will ever truly master it and fewer still will get it on video.

 

[Tanks]

I think the costs involved in running a double rifle means that very few will ever truly master it and fewer still will get it on video.

Ahem. I think I am decent with it, so are many others on this forum. Also, the OP is about a scoped .375 H&H, a medium bore rat caliber , with hardly any recoil. The cost is also minimal compared to the big bores especially if one reloads.

 

[crs]

Forrest,
Thanks for closing this tedious thread off for me. I would not exit without reading your comments.
For what it is worth, I detest the use of the word "running" as used to describe the use of a firearm, scope, ammo, etc. Just part of the dumbing down of our culture I suppose.
I may have been at this too long as it has become distracting to nod off mid thread. Too long is 70+ years of double guns. A nap should help. Happy Holidays to you.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Forrest,
Thanks for closing this tedious thread off for me. I would not exit without reading your comments.
For what it is worth, I detest the use of the word "running" as used to describe the use of a firearm, scope, ammo, etc. Just part of the dumbing down of our culture I suppose.
I may have been at this too long as it has become distracting to nod off mid thread. Too long is 70+ years of double guns. A nap should help. Happy Holidays to you.

@crs I'm happy to help! Hahaha! Have a wonderful Holiday season as well sir! I agree with you on the terminology. It's so call of duty operatoresque.

 

[Forrest Halley]

Ahem. I think I am decent with it, so are many others on this forum. Also, the OP is about a scoped .375 H&H, a medium bore rat caliber , with hardly any recoil. The cost is also minimal compared to the big bores especially if one reloads.

Brother @Tanks ,
Let's see a video of you "running" it like one of those cowboy shotguns. I don't think anyone can bring themselves to manipulate their double rifle that hard and fast.